You all gonna be here when I wake up?

Mal ,'Out Of Gas'


Other Media  

Discussion of Buffy and Angel comics, books, and more. Please don't get into spoilery details in the first week of release.


Miracleman - May 11, 2004 7:59:49 am PDT #2552 of 10000
No, I don't think I will - me, quoting Captain Steve Rogers, to all of 2020

I'd say Wolvie's close to the line. He gets up every day to do heroic stuff, but, as you say, he'd rather be drinkin' a beer and watchin' hockey. The group forces him to be a "superhero".


§ ita § - May 11, 2004 8:02:15 am PDT #2553 of 10000
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Belief -- is that it? Belief in an external ideal worth upholding through extraordinary effort?


Miracleman - May 11, 2004 8:09:13 am PDT #2554 of 10000
No, I don't think I will - me, quoting Captain Steve Rogers, to all of 2020

Belief -- is that it? Belief in an external ideal worth upholding through extraordinary effort?

Certainly that's a big part of it. Superman's never-ending battle for Truth, Justice and what used to be the American Way. Batman's belief that nobody should suffer what he did and those who try and make others suffer what he did should get the holy crap beat out of them.

Some of the legacy heroes have belief systems that seem to be hold-outs from their golden age predecessors. The Barry Allen and Wally West Flashes fight or fought the good fight because...well, Jay Garrick did and he called himself the Flash and if we're going to be the Flash then we have to do as he did...Same with Starman, Nuklon...

Kyle Rayner Green Lantern seems to be doing his heroics because Hal Jordan did. Hal Jordan did becaus Alan Scott did and because the Guardians said "You got the ring, you got the job and this is what the job entails."

Wonder Woman does it because that's her position as princess of Themyscira and her job as Ambassador to the world of man.

Aquaman did it because...well...that's what everybody else who was stronger or had extra-human abilities was doing and when in Rome...

Maybe that argument doesn't always hold up.


§ ita § - May 11, 2004 8:11:48 am PDT #2555 of 10000
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Does Aquaman have powers his compatriots lack?


victor infante - May 11, 2004 8:12:26 am PDT #2556 of 10000
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

Like I said before, the X-Men are dodgier propositions as "super-heroes" than one would think, and old Wolvie's probably straddling that line mostof all. That being said, he's probably a bit closer to it for Prof. X's influence than he'd be otherwise.

If there's a gray area here, he's it.


Miracleman - May 11, 2004 8:12:51 am PDT #2557 of 10000
No, I don't think I will - me, quoting Captain Steve Rogers, to all of 2020

Does Aquaman have powers his compatriots lack?

Telepathically talking to fish.

Um. Yeah, that's about it. Unless you call "Sovereign of 75% of the Planet" a power.


Steph L. - May 11, 2004 8:13:36 am PDT #2558 of 10000
I look more rad than Lutheranism

Telepathically talking to fish.

Batman could beat the crap out of the fish until it decides to talk to him verbally.


§ ita § - May 11, 2004 8:14:48 am PDT #2559 of 10000
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

the X-Men are dodgier propositions as "super-heroes" than one would think

I dunno. Taken individually, Jean, Beast, Storm, Cyclops -- all (usually) seem driven by noble impulses. There's a degree of refugee/shelterness to them, which sees them tied up with Morlocks, or Forge, or New Mutants, or whatever, but Cyclops seems an undeniable superhero to me.

Telepathically talking to fish.

How come he can do that, and other Atlanteans can't?


victor infante - May 11, 2004 8:15:00 am PDT #2560 of 10000
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

Does Aquaman have powers his compatriots lack?

Sure. He can breathe underwater (which, OK, so can Supes) and can communicate with and control sea life. And, while the Martian Manhunter's telepathy is more "powerful," Aquaman has pulled a few stunts with it that J'onn hasn't exhibited.


Kiba Rika - May 11, 2004 8:15:03 am PDT #2561 of 10000
I may have to seize the cat.

Aquaman is the shiznit, y'all.

Not quite up there with the Submariner, but so close.