I'm looking forward to the next 1602 very muchly indeed. It'll be interesting to see what--if anything--is resolved in regards to Ms. Dare.
You know, it's funny. We went to war never looking to come back, but it's the real world I couldn't survive.
Tracy ,'The Message'
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Discussion of Buffy and Angel comics, books, and more. Please don't get into spoilery details in the first week of release.
Anne W. - Oct 08, 2003 8:17:41 am PDT #1103 of 10000
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.
Volans - Oct 08, 2003 11:00:16 am PDT #1104 of 10000
move out and draw fire
Got 1602.3 at lunch. Just finished it. Mulling over some things, and waiting until some other folks have read it to discuss.
Anne W. - Oct 08, 2003 4:08:15 pm PDT #1105 of 10000
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.
Howdy, Raquel. I just finished 1602.3. I don't know about you, but even though it was somewhat telegraphed, I was a bit suprised by the last panel. I wasn't expecting Gaiman to muck around with actual historical continuity like that. Also, I'm starting to wonder a bit about the running gag with Peter's near misses with spiders, and things like his not being able to climb. It's the sort of thing that could be just a running gag, but with Gaiman, it could also mean so much more.
Also, the bit with the Grand Inquisitor and the Pope's lackey wasn't really that much of a surprise, but it did generate a nasty little chuckle from yrs truly.
What sorts of things prompted you to mull, m'dear?
Volans - Oct 08, 2003 4:53:21 pm PDT #1106 of 10000
move out and draw fire
Like you, the final panel. Also, (much white fonting): Virginia being the source of the bad weather? And whoever is watching (first page) saying that the bad weather could destroy the world? And who is that, the watcher? Same as the head that's on the moon in Strange's vision? Raised a lot more questions than it answered.
I did like the interaction between Natasha and DD, and the framing of the panels on the bard while the action occurs off-screen.
The plot with James and the Grand Inquisitor seems to have taken a back seat, but maybe it's layers on layers.
Steph L. - Oct 08, 2003 5:54:14 pm PDT #1107 of 10000
Unusually and exceedingly peculiar and altogether quite impossible to describe
Read 1603. And my first thought was "I can't remember my history very well -- was Queen Elizabeth really killed by Count Otto von Doom ???"
So very perplexed still by Virginia Dare.
Oh, and "Master John" Grey? So totally a woman. Or were we all thinking that all along? (Note: that isn't a spoiler for future issues -- as far as I know -- nor is it anything that was revealed in this issue.)
§ ita § - Oct 08, 2003 5:56:50 pm PDT #1108 of 10000
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I'm pretty sure John's a Jean.
Matt the Bruins fan - Oct 08, 2003 6:53:52 pm PDT #1109 of 10000
"I remember when they eventually introduced that drug kingpin who murdered people and smuggled drugs inside snakes and I was like 'Finally. A normal person.'” —RahvinDragand
Something I want to know is what's up with Clea? If this story is supposed to be something hinky actually happening to the Marvel Universe timeline... well, Clea was only partially human, born and raised in another dimension, and so far as I know currently lives there. I think it'd take a lot more doing to retcon an earth-based 17th century origin for her.
Then again, there has been speculation that she could be a lot older than she appears, so there's an outside chance that she somehow made the transition over from the Dark Dimension 400 years early.
Volans - Oct 09, 2003 2:05:08 am PDT #1110 of 10000
move out and draw fire
Maybe whatever caused the X-Men and the other heroes to appear 400 years early also pulled her in early?
Huh. (speculation) Maybe that "whatever" is Virginia Dare. She's one of the 3 (now 2) actual historial characters in 1602, but she's been written with all the shapechanging mystical powers. And she's the cause of the weather problems. So maybe her birth is what kicked off the Marvel Universe? Or, the settlement of America is what did it (which in a way is true; it's America what gave the world comic book heroes.)
But the cover of issue 2 makes more sense now.
DXMachina - Oct 09, 2003 2:37:11 am PDT #1111 of 10000
You always do this. We get tipsy, and you take advantage of my love of the scientific method.
(spoiler font): And whoever is watching (first page) saying that the bad weather could destroy the world? And who is that, the watcher?
Pretty much has to be the Watcher. One of Marvel's standard story framing devices has been the Watcher introducing the tale as a narrator. And he does live on the moon.
Virginia Dare can change into other creatures of the north, too, although the list doesn't seem to exactly match Snowbird's.
Concurring that John is a Jean.
Jeff Mejia - Oct 09, 2003 4:00:50 am PDT #1112 of 10000
"Don't think of yourself as an organic pain collector racing towards oblivion." Dogbert to Dilbert
I think that the first two panels that have the Watcher's narration, that talks about particles forming and disappearing in nanoseconds, with effects on the time and space. I'm guessing that will somehow bring this timeline and the "normal" Marvel timeline in synch.
Does anybody know off-hand how Elizabeth I died in real-life, or is some research in order. I have a feeling that her death as depicted here is probably not that far different than how she is reported to have died in real-life (excepting the Doom part, of course).
On a Doom-related note, why is he being called Otto Von Doom in this book? Isn't his name Victor, or am I missing something from early Marvel history?