Speaking as someone who has been around a while, and still doesn't feel completely like a Buffista(partly because I don't post a lot, partly because my opinions are frequently in the vast minority and partly because good percentage of my posts seem to be written in invisible ink), a lot of the discussion does seem come off as The Cabal Says There Is No Cabal, but I'm a bit hypersensitive on that issue.

I mean, I do realize that a good bit of the postings in Natter and elsewhere that irritate me are just So-and-So's wacky sense of humor, so I should just chill, but there does seem to be the feeling that some can get away things others can't.

Argh, I'm not making sense here, and I'm repeating what more articulate posters have said, so I'll go back to lurking in this thread.

Sophia is me, in here anyway.

The problem is that we---those of us that were here before the Firefly Population Explosion---are on the defensive with everyone.

I don't think any of the new members are really getting the kind of welcome that they would have gotten if they had shown up before Firelfy aired or if they had shown up on Worldcrossing.

From my point of view it seems that everyone new is seen as a potentional trouble maker rather than someone who is cool.

I know the attitude before about new people was "one of us! one of us!" and now the attitude is "prove yourself."

I've seen more than one post that starts "I didn't find this board through a Firefly Link" or "I'm not here because of Firefly, I 'm a long time lurker."

And frankly it bothers me that people feel that they have to justify why they are here before they even say anything.

Now, I'm not saying that's how ALL the Buffistas are acting, but that's how THOSE posters felt. That they had to make sure that we knew they were okay before they posted anything. back on TT, we aren't a collection of threads that had to go hide wh

Is this the definition of a clique? If Sebastian is perminantly shut out from the "hey bitch" stage because he came around too late, then yeah.

But these people don't get the chance. If Sebastian tried that and all your friends jumped on his shit and made him feel like leaving never to return...

That's true. But I don't think that what's been happening here, at least not in the threads I've read. Sebastian -- and by Sebastian I pretty much mean that Meinike guy -- hasn't gotten off one "Hey bitch," been gang thwapped, and run off. He's said it, been advised against it, and repeated it with a non-charming mixture of defensiveness and insults. People seemed to get a bit tense over the situation and Bureaucracy swelled in a near-histaminic reaction. It's still kinda red and tender (to over-stretch a metaphore) and smaller stimuli are irritating it. But it seems like people have still been going with at least one request for chilling when they've felt upset by another person's post. It's when the response to that request is lacking that people get unwelcoming. Is this group-jump happening in The Music Swells thread, or another I'm not reading?

There was a great deal of dismay expressed when the link here appeared in places we didn't put it. Not a quote: "There will be people coming here we may not like! It's too late to protect ourselves! The days of wine and roses are over." Maybe we could have gone into more of a "Do we have enough glasses for everyone? What about chairs? OK, we'll all sit on the floor" mode.

And gossip is what's made that possible. IJS.

Urg. Well, if that's true, I guess I'd rather have not known it.

Yep, we're all learning how bologna is made, and it's not necessarily a pretty sight.

But, Connie, it's a sociological truth that a lot of new people coming in at the same time endangers the stability of the existing group. Whether it's your real-life neighborhood (hello, gentrification!) or your virtual one. I think there was some overreaction to the board getting all the publicity it did, but I understood where it was coming from, and it makes more sense, in terms of how communities actually function, than your suggested alternative. Which I do, however, like, because it has made Cher's debate speech (ETA: Alicia Silverstone's character in Clueless -- not the singer!) about US immigration policies replay in the back of my head. "And, in conclusion, may I please remind you that it does not say R.S.V.P. on the Statue of Liberty?"

Look, I'm sorry if this makes people uncomfortable, but this is a LARGE group of people, even when it was just 100 people. Not everyone is going to love everyone else. What makes it a workable community is that everyone can either interact well, or not interact at all, with everyone else. People say things I don't agree with, or that I think are silly, or don't drop things I'd love to see dropped, or whatever. I am a person who likes to talk about things, but not always make a huge issue out of everything. I send a quick eye-rolly e-mail, and feel much better. I mean, I do this with meatspace friends, too -- do you people not? I have a core group of 5 or 6 friends, and I will have the occasional conversation with one of them about another. Am I really the only person who does this?

Hi. Staying out of this a bit--more interested in what other people think right now--but, really, as far as I can see, there've only been "complaints" about two (or possibly one) poster, and a general sense of annoyance with another one (except that person stayed firmly within the rules, but they found themsleves jumped on, mostly by "old-timers.")

I'd like to point out that we've had, in the same period of time, at least two or three or more new users a day, often more. Very few of them post, and many that do have been just fine.

I've more than once asked people to chill, and more than once it's revolved around Schmoker. On the other hand, I can't help but think that a few folks were being more...reactionary...than neccessary.

There've been a lot of changes here lately. I'm okay with all of them. I'm still okay with everybody. But I really think people need to relax a little, remember that, on occasion, people are going to be jerks and to not let themselves get caught up in it. Because a few people really DO stir up a pot, but only you can let them get to you.

And, if it does get out of hand, they'll get stomped.