Do we have that big a problem with political discussions? The one Caroma mentioned seems to me more the exception than the rule. I have no problem with political topics coming up in Natter. For one thing, I don't think they come up all that often, and usually in response to something major going on - which means we'd likely want to be talking about it anyway. I guess I just don't see the problem here.

but the natter that evolves from it then has to move back to natter, and it seems to squash the conversation that was evolving naturally.

I don't believe that to be true. Natter is only squashed by admins in the "right column" threads.

When I start dropping loud Doblerize hints, it's reached near-toasty. It's not that it doesn't start off polite, it's just that some posters are oil and water about the subject, and it's going to get unmixey sooner rather than later.

But, see, maybe I'm in the minority, but those discussions interest me the most. I sometimes want something really spicy and volatile.

So, I vote for the Assholes Thread, where we Assholes can be Assholes to each other, with the understanding that no hothouse flowers will cry and stomp off and say, "I'm leaving forever!" So that people will collectively say, "No, please don't go, we're begging you to stay, and we're sorry we were so passionate. Here, have some white bread."

See what an Asshole I am?

Seriously, I think the mix of hothouse flowers and spewing volcanoes temper each other, nicely.

But, see, maybe I'm in the minority, but those discussions interest me the most. I sometimes want something really spicy and volatile.

There's spicy, and then there's worrying about having to scream "DO I HAVE TO TURN THIS CAR AROUND???"* when people are fighting.

Spicy I like. The other I don't.

*Standard Disclaimer: There is no official weight behind this urge, just the typical spent-too-much-time-with-rug-rats reaction.

The thing about the Assholes thread is, the internet is full of assholes. Heck, the world is full of assholes. The thing I enjoy about the Buffistas is they manage to be both not assholes, and not boring, which is a rarer combination than you'd think.

Do we have that big a problem with political discussions?

I don't think we do right now. A lot of that, of course, is that they only come up sporadically (which of course is an argument against a separate thread). It's also because, IMO, this place encourages standards of discourse.

I actually worry that if we have a thread dedicated to politics, it'll get harder to uphold those standards. Because politics does engage people's emotions, and it's relatively easy to cause bad feeling, and over the course of a single argument that bad feeling can escalate as people act just a bit more out of a sense of grievance.

I don't think that's become a problem here, at least in part because the discussions stop. Eventually the nattery natterness takes over, the politics takes a back seat again and any bad feeling gets a chance to subside. I fear that if we had a dedicated politics thread, that chance to let matters cool off could be compromised, at least some of the time.

I think we have different spicy tolerances, Plei. My spicy is someone else's flame war. This is because I lack tact and patience, so it's all on me.

I actually worry that if we have a thread dedicated to politics, it'll get harder to uphold those standards.

I'm with Billytea. Any emotions raised in the politics thread is going to bleed over into other threads as well. We just kicked someone out for not complying with our community standards. Let's not make a forum where it's easy to fail to meet those (fairly high) standards.

What this boils down to, I think, is what kind of board do we want to evolve into? Are we a Jossverse discussion board with other-topic threads, or are we a general discussion board with Jossverse threads? Are we a media/entertainment discussion board with extra natter? When Buffy and Angel end, what will the objection to a Politics thread be then?

I'm conflicted. On the one hand, I'd like to think of us as (at least primarily) a Buffy/Angel/Firefly board, and I'm against rampant thread proliferation on general principle. On the other...the shows won't be around forever, and when that happens, I think we probably will become a general discussion board w/ Jossverse accessories, in which case Cooking & Politics & What Are You Wearing Today threads make a lot of sense. On the other other hand, I'm incredibly resistant to major changes to the structure of my world, so my instinct is to keep specific topic threads to a minimum until all Joss' shows are off the air. On the other other other hand, I'd probably lurk happily in a Politics thread, so...I'm conflicted.

What this boils down to, I think, is what kind of board do we want to evolve into? Are we a Jossverse discussion board with other-topic threads, or are we a general discussion board with Jossverse threads? Are we a media/entertainment discussion board with extra natter? When Buffy and Angel end, what will the objection to a Politics thread be then?

Again, this is still a newbie's perspective, which may be refreshing, or may just be way off base. Stumbling across this place and getting hooked on it as I have, it seems to me that you have not just a message board for talking about that which is Joss, but a community. You have nicknames for each other. You have inside jokes which you warn and educate people about in your FAQ. You have, what appears to be, a tight-nit collection of people that support each other on a wide number of fronts, and this is a comfortable, happy place where you can bring in your personalities without fear of feelings getting bruised.

I describe this because, a community of people that care about each other can talk about anything. You're not strangers.

It feels like you're wrestling with the conflicting pros and cons of growing and changing purposes and defining structure. In a small community, there are fewer strangers, and everyone knows everyone else. Growing, however, brings fresh faces and fresh ideas. Adding a purpose and applying structure means losing some of the flexibility that allows natter to proliferate. It also means that you keep conversations focused, and when you have problems, you have methods and procedures well established for dealing with them.

I'm writing this as an outsider. I think I see what makes this place so special to so many of you. t /Long Winded Natter

Summary: A politics thread isn't necessary for a community such as what you have here. It would, however, be a handy utility if the purpose of this place was to change to be more of "just a message board".