Consuela hit the John that I see in my head.

I suspect John could, and sometimes did, drink to excess, but not often, and not while working.

Going through that crap every day, I could see hitting the bottle every once in a while.

socially backwards

I just think that Dean doesn't have a good grasp of what "normal" is. As in, the standard of average which Dean's life is not. Dean is the dutiful son, the mini!John, being the surrogate father (or mother?) to Sam, but Sam was the one who was a bit of an outsider. He barely remembers his mother, and always felt removed from the Family Business. He left for Stanford and spent 4 or so years studying people (and he's a smart one, that Sam) and learning how to play normal. Hell, maybe he even became a little normal, until the YED killed Jess. Dean's got his suave, his sarcasm, his natural charm, but he can't play normal like Sam can.

You know, if they'd just put more normal conversation into movies and on tv, Dean could totally replicate it (to whatever degree it's supported in canon, my Dean totally watched/s a LOT of hotel-room cable). He's been demonstrated to be able to play whatever professional part fairly well, hasn't he? (I've not seen all of S1, I think)

He's been good at cops and others on the right side of the law, not so much on the softer gigs (priest? art dealer? grief counselor? riiiiight).

Which is not to say that I think he was always kind to the boys, and I do want to slap him in "Home" and "Faith" for not (apparently) doing something. But he's desperate at that point--he knows it's a demon by then, and demons are something they don't really know how to deal with, and he also knows something about the special children, so he knows Sam is at risk. He cannot risk drawing its attention to them.

Consuela, I'm assuming you're referring to John not actually physically getting involved in their situations at that point. Which I could almost accept, if he weren't sitting in Missouri's living room in Lawrence during "Home." That's close enough to the boys for the demons, I would think. And it still doesn't explain why he can make all those officious phone calls and send text messages sending them to haunted apple orchards and asylums to rescue strangers, but can't spare 60 seconds to ask how his own sons are doing. If phone calls and text messages are safe (i.e., won't leave a trail leading the YED to Sam/Dean) then dammit, Pick Up the Phone and call them!.

In "Salvation" when John pulls his truck off the road and shows how upset he is that Pastor Jim has been killed, and then later shows how upset he is that Caleb has been killed, I was thinking, yeah, but where was all this emotion when your own son was dying? Yes, I have John issues. I hurt on behalf of the boys.

Ok, so.... someone needs to take Simon Says away from me. Because I've watched Dean sing Speedwagon about ten times in the last ten minutes, and my poor fangirl brain canna take it.

I don't disagree on any of that, really, Morgana. I do think he may have fucked up, because we don't know his reasoning in any detail, for why it was okay to call the boys in "Scarecrow" but not in "Faith".

I know he did some unforgiveable things in the name of protecting them. I'm quite sure he felt he didn't have a choice.

And if it meant protecting them so they would be alive instead of dead, I think he would be okay with that. Even if they never did forgive him.

That's my take on John.

someone needs to take Simon Says away from me. Because I've watched Dean sing Speedwagon about ten times in the last ten minutes, and my poor fangirl brain canna take it.

Ailleann, I'm hoping the CW reruns the beginning of this season at some point, because I have all the episodes except 1-6 on tape. So I'm missing that one, dammit. And I'm going to be tightly clutching the tapes to my chest until the next set of DVDs comes out.

Hopefully they'll fill time in the summer, Morgana.

you're a candle in the window on a cold dark winter's night...

*is ded*

I was doing the flailing over "Croatoan" last night, as I do every time I see it. I know Sam is the unquestioned holder of the title "High Prince of Angst," but damn if Dean didn't bring it home. Knowing that he unquestioningly stayed behind, knowing that they were out of options, fully planning to execute Sam when the time came, and then to kill himself.... wibble. Oh, boys....

My main frustration with the John-haters is -- wtf is NORMAL in that situation?

I think he did the best he could in a really weird situation.