Didn't she give the painting to Keith? Why would she care what Keith did with it?

no, it was the painting that the cop found with blood on it.

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That one girl has played a sorority type girl in EVERY show. . . .okay, LOTS of shows. (You know, Jack's ex-girlfriend the Preacher's Kid from Jack and Bobby. )

Thank you, sumi. Scott and I spent the entire episode trying to remember where we'd seen her, before. It was definitely on Jack and Bobby.

I hadn't recognised her, but the guard guy played Sean on Boy Meets World. I haven't watched that show since sometime around middle school, and I still can't disassociate him from that character.

Yes. And the Horshack kid is Samm Levine, who played Neal Schweiber on Freaks and Geeks. Oh, now I see Gris mentioned that, but I love my F&G kids, so I'll say it again.

Didn't she give the painting to Keith? Why would she care what Keith did with it?

Jon, I think she showed up with the painting (In last season's "Not Pictured") needing Keith's help to flee with it. She probably bought it to make the money more portable/less obvious.

I'm not catching the "Homer" references. Was the actor who provides his voice in this episode? If so, which character did he play?

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Dan Castallaneta

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There was a flashback where it's revealed that the reason Keith skipped out on Veronica in NYC was because of getting the painting.

I may actually have to rewatch the episode....

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I can't believe no one's mentioned Homer Simpson!

smacks forhead

I kept thinking he looked familiar. I kept going to Jonathan Katz, who I always thought looked a little like DC, but I knew it wasn't him. It's been a while since I've seen Castallaneta in anything, though (probably the Simpsons' ep of Inside the Actor's Studio)

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no, it was the painting that the cop found with blood on it.

Sonofagun, you're right -- I just rewatched. So how did Keith get the paperwork for it?

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Wow, torture! rape! murder! AWESOME.

I don't know if it's just that the pictures that got smaller (i.e., changes to what makes me happy viewing TV) or what.

I physically cringed every time the torture plot came on screen. I finished the episode just hating how I spent the previous hour. I've been mulling over what's changed- what I want/need from my tv shows, if I've become that reviled teevee consumer that wants everything handed to them and a happy ending (I don't *think* so, but hey, maybe), or if this show has gone over the noir line to nihlism and is so fucking depressing that I can't trust it with any of my emotional investment.

Anyway, yeah. We'll see.

ION, Ed Begley Jr!!!!!! Yet another 80s star back to shine on VM. He's sure to be a dastardly villian.

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I physically cringed every time the torture plot came on screen.

I was just bemused because we'd been discussing the Stanford Experiment in another thread recently.

So how did Keith get the paperwork for it?

That was my BIG WTF for this ep.

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When the prof. started explaining the experiment, I expected the guard-prisoner storyline was going to bother me a lot more than it did. I was afraid Wallace was going to turn, or that we'd see Logan as a jailer and that he'd be channelling his inner-Aaron. Honestly, I thought it was fairly unbelievable that one kid instantly went corrupt, and none of the other (guard) kids either also went that way, or gave him a stomping.

I've been mulling over what's changed- what I want/need from my tv shows, if I've become that reviled teevee consumer that wants everything handed to them and a happy ending (I don't *think* so, but hey, maybe), or if this show has gone over the noir line to nihlism and is so fucking depressing that I can't trust it with any of my emotional investment.

Couldn't your preference be changing in a way that isn't an indictment of your taste, ya goober?

I don't think the show has gone over any line it didn't leave in the rearview mirror in the season 1 pilot, because the first season was all about isolation, exhile, loss of trust, murder, possible-incest, and we knew from the get-go that our protagonist had been raped, and the law couldn't care less.

Of course I don't see nihilism in VM. I do see pessimism, but it's somewhat like the pessimism of Angel, to me: If nothing that we do matters, all that matters is what we do.

Veronica knows she's damned if she does, and damned if she doesn't, but she Does, and that, to me, makes all the difference.

I do think though, that these first two episodes have been lackluster. I've enjoyed them in the irrational-fangirl way, because I was jonesing for the show all summer, but when I try to imagine seeing it through the eyes of a new viewer, I decide it hasn't done anything to pull me in. If the season continues like this, I suspect I am going to have to prepare myself for cancelation, because I just don't think this it is getting the job done, so far.

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So how did Keith get the paperwork for it?

That was my BIG WTF for this ep.

He probably already had it from when Kendall bought it (or maybe she didn't buy it, and Big Dick already had it in his collection). He might have been holding it for Kendall for all we know.

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