It's simple. I slap 'em around a bit, torture 'em, make their lives hell...Sure, the nice guys'll run away,but every now and then you'll find a prince like Spike who gets off on it.

Buffy ,'Get It Done'


Veronica Mars: Annoy, Tiny Blonde One. Annoy Like the Wind.

[NAFDA] Spoiler Policy: Seasons 1-3 and the movie are fair game. Spoiler font two weeks for new content presented all at once (e.g. Season 4 on Hulu is fair game as of Aug. 9, 2019). New content presented as weekly episodes may be discussed with no restrictions as it is released.


Topic!Cindy - Apr 27, 2006 12:27:27 pm PDT #2646 of 5730
What is even happening?

Yeah, that's what I've gone off of. And the bag supposedly ended up in the hands of Betina, but before that...it was Dick. It's possible he was supposed to have it with him in the limo, but the perpetrator didn't count on his noble act.

But (assuming he was telling Veronica the truth) Dick picked up the Prize out of the trash, after Pete threw it away. It's a believable detail, because of Pete's, "Why would I go," re the fieldtrip. It would have only gotten to Dick by accident--him picking it out of the trash.


Polter-Cow - Apr 27, 2006 12:53:27 pm PDT #2647 of 5730
What else besides ramen can you scoop? YOU CAN SCOOP THIS WORLD FROM DARKNESS!

Yeah, you're right. I couldn't remember the exact trail of the bag. I don't know anything anymore! All I know is that CERVANDO KILLED FELIX.


Kalshane - Apr 27, 2006 12:57:02 pm PDT #2648 of 5730
GS: If you had to choose between kicking evil in the head or the behind, which would you choose, and why? Minsc: I'm not sure I understand the question. I have two feet, do I not? You do not take a small plate when the feast of evil welcomes seconds.

So here's some points currently rattling aroud in my brain:

  • Woody somehow knew that something was going to happen to the bus because he begged Gia not to take it back to the school.

  • Explosives from the demoltion company working on tearing down Shark's Field showed up in a locker in the hangar Woody owns and Terrence keeps his cars, the night before the detailer was due to work on said cars.

  • Detailer didn't notice said explosives the last time he had worked on said cars, and I believe (though not sure) the schedule meant he would have been out there between the time of the crash and when the explosives were found.

  • Danny Boyd works for the demolition company.

  • We know Woody isn't above sacrificing an ally to save his own neck after this week.

  • Liam Fitzpatrick passed the limo and the bus on the PCH shortly before it crashed.

  • The Fitzpatricks have been hired as heavies in the past to try and collect on Terrence Cook's gambling debts.

  • Curly Moran seemed incredibly broken up about the crash.

  • The PCHers recieved an anonymous tip, dialed from within untrafficked area of Logan's house, that Curly was responsible for the crash.

  • Curly said he knew who had caused the crash when Weevil was beating him up.

  • Thumper was recording Curly's beating with his cellphone.

  • As soon as Curly said he knew who did it, a car parked nearby turned its lights on, chasing off the PCHers.

  • Curly washes up dead on the beach the next day with Veronica's name written on his hand.

While I don't think Woody is directly responsible for the crash, I do think he had foreknowledge, possibly through dealings with the Fitzpatricks.

I think the Fitzpatricks rigged the bomb in the bus, though I don't know on whose orders.

I think Thumper had one of the Fitzpatricks on the phone when Weevil was beating Curly, and as soon as they heard Curly knew who it was, they hit their lights, to drive off the PCHers and then killed Curly.

I think the reason Curly knew who it was, and felt so guilty about it, was someone asked him how he did the Long Haul stunt. They then used that knowledge to crash the bus.

I think the explosives turned up in the hangar either because someone was threatening to frame Woody with the crash and Woody decided to frame Cook instead, or another form of intimidation over Cook's gambling debts via the Fitzpatricks.


Topic!Cindy - Apr 27, 2006 1:07:18 pm PDT #2649 of 5730
What is even happening?

The PCHers recieved an anonymous tip, dialed from within untrafficked area of Logan's house, that Curly was responsible for the crash.
Do you think Lucky made the call?

I think Thumper had one of the Fitzpatricks on the phone when Weevil was beating Curly, and as soon as they heard Curly knew who it was, they hit their lights, to drive off the PCHers and then killed Curly.

Hhmmm. Good one.

I think the reason Curly knew who it was, and felt so guilty about it, was someone asked him how he did the Long Haul stunt. They then used that knowledge to crash the bus.

I agree. And for some reason, I keep thinking Big Dick. Did Big Dick take Cassidy along when he met Curly, once? What episode was that revealed in. In my head, I can see Veronica or Keith watching or listening to a tape of Lamb interviewing Cassidy, and Gia, and I don't know who else.


Kalshane - Apr 27, 2006 1:13:15 pm PDT #2650 of 5730
GS: If you had to choose between kicking evil in the head or the behind, which would you choose, and why? Minsc: I'm not sure I understand the question. I have two feet, do I not? You do not take a small plate when the feast of evil welcomes seconds.

Do you think Lucky made the call?

That's a possibility. Though we know the PCHers crashed the party, so it also could have been Thumper or one of his patsies. Though Weevil might have recognized their voice, so that's iffy.

I agree. And for some reason, I keep thinking Big Dick. Did Big Dick take Cassidy along when he met Curly, once? What episode was that revealed in. In my head, I can see Veronica or Keith watching or listening to a tape of Lamb interviewing Cassidy, and Gia, and I don't know who else.

Yes. Curly was the mechanic for a good number of the 09ers. I can't remember which episode it was, but Keith has stolen the interview tapes from the sherrif's office about the bus crash. In his, Beaver mentioned meeting Curly once when Big Dick had taken him along to have the car serviced. He said normally his father took Little Dick becuase cars were "man stuff".


Topic!Cindy - Apr 27, 2006 1:18:15 pm PDT #2651 of 5730
What is even happening?

Kalshane, I think it was RaWgtWC.

That could have been when Curly told Dick about the stunt for The Long Haul.


Kalshane - Apr 27, 2006 1:25:02 pm PDT #2652 of 5730
GS: If you had to choose between kicking evil in the head or the behind, which would you choose, and why? Minsc: I'm not sure I understand the question. I have two feet, do I not? You do not take a small plate when the feast of evil welcomes seconds.

What's Big Dick's motivation, though? I mean, sure, insurance money, but his real estate empire had not yet collapsed so it's not like he really needed it. And who put the rat on board, thus insuring that the rich kids got off the bus? Plus, if Big Dick wanted his kids dead, why let them borrow his limo?

The only way I can see that work is if he assumed that little Dick would leave Beaver on the bus instead of taking him along. I can see him not caring overly much if Beaver bought it. Especially if he could profit from it.


Topic!Cindy - Apr 27, 2006 2:18:47 pm PDT #2653 of 5730
What is even happening?

What's Big Dick's motivation, though? I mean, sure, insurance money, but his real estate empire had not yet collapsed so it's not like he really needed it. And who put the rat on board, thus insuring that the rich kids got off the bus? Plus, if Big Dick wanted his kids dead, why let them borrow his limo?

I don't know. I don't think Dick was trying to kill his own kids for the insurance money, at all. If he's involved, I suspect just the opposite, that he called Little Dick, knowing he'd hear how the bus smelled badly, and he'd suggest the limo, knowing Little Dick would take him up on it.

If Big Dick is partly behind the crash, I do think greed/power might have been a motive, but I don't know to what end.

Maybe he was afraid the incorporation proposal would screw up the valuation of some of his REITs, and he was trying to create a county scandal to damage Woody's credibility?

Keith said these things are often personal. Maybe Big Dick has a personal grudge against Woody and was trying to create a county scandal because of that? Maybe Woody was onto the graft deal with the Assessor and was trying to make Big Dick his bitch, the way he tried to double deal Keith? Maybe Woody did molest Cassidy and Big Dick knew, and maybe that accounts for some of Big Dick's extreme ignorage of Cassidy?

Of course none of these things convinces me that Big Dick would take out a busload of kids, but maybe for Big Dick, money is personal? He said that thing to Logan about how when he's working his family doesn't exist and vice versa. I suppose it doesn't explain why Woody told Gia not to ride back on the bus, either. But maybe for Big Dick, money is personal? He said that thing to Logan about how when he's working his family doesn't exist and vice versa.

Maybe it was supposed to happen after the bus was back, and Kendall got Liam to blow it up when it blew, not knowing Cassidy and Dick weren't on the bus?

Ooof.


victor infante - Apr 27, 2006 2:24:44 pm PDT #2654 of 5730
To understand what happened at the diner, we shall use Mr. Papaya! This is upsetting because he's the friendliest of fruits.

But it wasn't registered in Neptune, right? I remember being confused by this point while watching.

It lives in the garage. I imagine it's not registered at all.

In other stray thoughts, one thing has stuck with me for a good, long while, all the way back to "Rashard & Wallace Go To White Castle":

Father Patrick: I wasn't always on the up-and-up God-wise myself. But I worked at it. There's a passage, Romans 12:19. "Vengeance is mine. I will repay, sayeth the Lord."

It was undercut by a Veronica witticism, but it struck me at the time, and as little as we've seen Father Patrick, he and the church have been in the background a lot. Drugs were being run through there. Thumper was "mugged" there. Weevil confessed there. Father Patrick has been saying things about the incorporation.

Add to this that we never got a good reason why Dr. Griffith should be coerced to convict Logan. Why would the Fitzpatricks care if one of the PCHers went down? Sure, they were working for the Fitzpatricks, but it seems unlikely that they'd care -- they sure weren't afraid they'd go tattle when they were getting roughed up. Thumper was smart and had proof on them, sure, but no one knew about that.

So who was on that paddle?

Last tiny little bit, all the way back to the season premier:

Harken to our good friends at Mars Investigations: Logan, Dick, and Beaver set fire to the community pool, causing it to close for the summer. This is yet another battle in the haves vs. have-nots war.

Is that what really happened there? First time around, we only have Veronica's inference that it happened that way. When we see that time again in flashback, Lucky's involved, Logan and Dick seem completely disinterested (they want to smoke pot and play video games.) and Beaver's nowhere to be seen.

Ultimately, the haves were outnumbered at the ballot box by the have nots, who were motivated to vote. Their kids were killed on the bus. Their community pool was burned down. Every event in the course of the show, including in one instance a seemingly class conflict-driven action by someome who deeply hates Woody (Lucky) and the scandals surrounding a deeply hated '09er (Logan) led to the incorporation's failure.

Who profits?

Romans 12:20-21: Therefore, if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink; for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

Be not overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.


Topic!Cindy - Apr 27, 2006 2:39:59 pm PDT #2655 of 5730
What is even happening?

Is that what really happened there? First time around, we only have Veronica's inference that it happened that way.

What do you mean by 'inference' here, victor? Veronica had a flashback of being with Logan, and seeing Dick and Beaver. Dick made a point to speak to her (I think that's when he said the "And Logan's special lady friend of whom I approve whole-heartedly"), so it wasn't her just putting the pieces together and imagining. Either the incidence with Lucky was a separate one, or the same one, but later on.

Add to this that we never got a good reason why Dr. Griffith should be coerced to convict Logan. Why would the Fitzpatricks care if one of the PCHers went down? Sure, they were working for the Fitzpatricks, but it seems unlikely that they'd care -- they sure weren't afraid they'd go tattle when they were getting roughed up. Thumper was smart and had proof on them, sure, but no one knew about that.

The PCHers ordered the hit. Thumper carried it out, and he and whomever, set up Logan. It was to the Fitzpatrick's benefit to help Thumper with his framing of Logan, because they knew there had been an eyewitness who hadn't come forward. By producing a false eyewitness, they ensured someone who wasn't actually connected to them was convicted.

They wanted to beat the real eyewitness to the punch. There'd been a lot of community heat since the murder. If the real eyewitness came forward and fingered the PCHers, how long would it have been before Thumper turned state's evidence on the Fitzpatricks?