We gotta go to the crappy town where I'm the hero!

Wash ,'Jaynestown'


The Minearverse 4: Support Group for Clumsy People  

[NAFDA] "There will be an occasional happy, so that it might be crushed under the boot of the writer." From Zorro to Angel (including Wonderfalls and The Inside), this is where Buffistas come to anoint themselves in the bloodbath.


Nilly - Apr 30, 2006 10:35:25 am PDT #9738 of 10001
Swouncing

You guys had much longer road trips than we ever had. Of course, you also have much more of a length of those roads to travel through them, so I guess that makes sense. Also, we have just the one state, so practically no options for any licence-plate games.

So instead of going on an 18-hour drive, I went back to Kristen's link and read the second script. And did the not-really-watch-and-post-but-read-me-ramble thing. Allyson, the thread would be a few posts shorter after that, I think, as the definition of "rambling" goes.

Um, first, if I remember correctly - that's not the second episode that was broadcast, right? There's no episode named "Hide and Seek" on the episodes list, so how did it end up being named? And where in the order of broadcast did it end up?

I love the nice little twist with the file and the picture, the "not show Web", how it's an ultrasound picture and not something out of a murder scene - it's still rebellious, but in a completely different way than not showing the scary-undecipherable boss something work related, it cuts straight to the fact that Paul and Web have an interesting relationship, shows that Rebecca is somewhat out of touch and distant, and even tying life (and the beginning of it) and death (and what comes afterwards) together in format, so to speak. And all in what, five lines? probably not even a minute on screen? Neat.

I still hear Jayne in Danny (the whole talking about cakes and breakfasts, in between the serious discussion of Paul and Carla about having a 'real' life). Did it sound Jayne-ish at all?

And I also like how Rebecca's background is hinted in what she sees as being safe and protection to the child - show the world as it is, bring him to the FBI building, trust that he's tough - exactly her defense mechanism, or at least so it seems now, in regards to her difficult past.

And it ties right to the murder - Paul says that building better walls would protect the child, but we see what may be the best description of a protected home, with the lawns and the home-made breakfast and even a fence around a pool, but still, nothing helped, and that poor mother had to see the body of her poor kid. And the description - the pink water, moving the point of view to the underwater angle - was really chilling to read.

So, again, it's not just about a murder case and solving it and "who did it" and how to trick them - it's about the issues at the core heart of the crew, about what concerns them and fills their lives, *outside* of their job. I love that.

Some stuff is printed in blue - does that mean they were cut from the script, or at least changed, at its final stage? Or from the shooting of the show? Or is it just something wrong with the pdf file, and I'm trying to find meaning where there's none? After all, it's not like Web typed these things or something, right?

Hmm, does Web have some secret agenda in taking a case with a dead child? Surely, he knows the stage of Paul's wife pregnancy, and therefore that Paul doesn't talk with him about it, and therefore that Paul tries to protect his future child from these aspects of the world? Because I think - based on the former episode - that Web can pretty much have whatever several-reasons-together to do what he does, at least one of them concerns his crew. For both better and worse, sometimes at the same time.

And Rebecca is still not realizing the difficulties for Paul in this case (offering to look at the parents first, with Paul being a future parent and already worried for the safety of his child from the life that he himself leads).

Rebecca thinks all this safety is a lie, because none of these safety measures worked for herself as a child, and later, as a grownup, never helped her leave her past behind, right? For her, it seems like the truth - facing the horror in all its gore, finding the answers - is what helps, then? So it's the opposite of Paul.

(continued...)


Nilly - Apr 30, 2006 10:35:30 am PDT #9739 of 10001
Swouncing

( continues...) Does Web ever think about anything with the word "safe" in it? Is that even a concern for him? He's the character that fascinates me most, right now. And Rebecca thinks she starts to figure him out, with her remark about taking the case because it was interesting. And there's the pressure that may or may not have been put on him by the mayor, that he may or may not caved to. And then there's the playing with Paul's mind and heart. And that's just for now, so there may be more.

The line "there are no strangers here" makes everything scarier, for me - because if it weren't a stranger who had done this, then it was somebody they know. An evil that hides within. The security measures may block things coming from the outside, but what about what's inside? And there, I've used the name of the show again, without thinking about it until I typed it out loud.

I loved the exchange of "you're kidding" - "because I do that" between Paul and Web. It's like Web does everything he can in order to throw Paul off in this case. Oh, and Danny's glee about being the good cop is, again, Jayne-like, in a good way.

I loved it - as horrible and sad that plot point may be - that the witness, too, not just the victim, was a child. It focused, again, the story, for me, on the whole point of trying to protect children, from bad things happening to them as well as from seeing bad things. Hmm, now I wonder if the murder itself wasn't anything to do with childhood, innocence or supposed one, or anything like that, just to complete the circle.

Goodness, Rebecca had to see Paul interrogating a little girl in order to realize that he could make a good father - it's like she sees everything through the FBI lenses she put on.

I loved the contradicting back-and-forths between the interrogations: Danny's style when compared to Paul's, the way the details accumulated in both the stories revealed, how they completed each other, the difference between the witnesses, of course. They talking - or not - of fault. Wanting "my mommy" and the grownups protector, a lawyer.

And I loved that while Bunch started off lying, it was Madison who traded places with him and is now lying herself. Bot so innocent after all, I guess. Hmm.

No, not just "hmm"! Now they - or, well, Rebecca (and Web?) - think that she's actually the killer! You can't get more "from within you" than that, I guess. Bunch worked there, but Madison was one of those that the parents tried to protect from what's outside.

Web ties it all up for Rebecca to her childhood. It's like he doesn't let her look around her instinct as just "instinct" and make her examine it as a thought process. It could be either, but before she chooses the "easy" answer, he makes her consider all possibilities.

He couldn't possibly have known that a girl in Rebecca's age, when she was kidnapped, was involved in the murder, right? Because if he could, that would give him yet another reason for taking the case - confronting Rebecca with her past - on top of all the others. But he couldn't, so he didn't. But he definitely made good use of it!

And it's the same but the exact opposite, isn't it? A stolen innocence, lack of ability to protect. But with Rebecca, it was taken from her. With Madison, she's the one doing the taking, even of her own safety, by herself. She's both the little girl and the person who changes her.

And, oh, I loved how Rebecca said that - "I don't see myself when I look at her. I see the man who took me." Being in such a difficult place helps her make the separation not many could.

And Web, of course, making her look inside and come with the correct answer, both for her peace of mind and for her job, continues to play. I loved that exchange - "Are you putting us against each other?" - "Yes". So simple, direct, and, well, evil and practical at the same time. While Rebecca may be the character with the most, oh, how can I put it, attempting-to-be-OK? Deserving of a "you can do it, girl!"? The character who is most interesting is definitely Web, for me.

(continued...)


Nilly - Apr 30, 2006 10:35:40 am PDT #9740 of 10001
Swouncing

( continues...) I loved how the questions Paul started with, with Madison, trying to make her feel comfortable and talking to him, may end up being important. the names of the friends (the same Nora who just entered, in my reading the Olsen home, who liked to play with little children). How, again, it all ties back to the children. The maybe-innocence, maybe hiding-of-innocence, which is even worse that a simple lack of it, because of the previously-thought-of concealing attempts.

Um, I can't stand Tessa. The bossy, knows-it-all, tells-everybody-what's-good-for-them, taking-over-the-situation Tessa. And pretending to be helping out and being all kindness and care while she's at it, too. Oof. Poor Ellen.

Oh, just like Madison seems to be pretending to be a good scared innocent little girl, as the perfect disguise of the opposite of that, which she may be (um, I think at this point that she is, despite the knife being Bunch's. Maybe even because of that - she's already taken one step in trying to frame him, what prevents her from taking another, only ahead, and deliberately using his distinct knife? Didn't they say earlier than her oh-so-nice mom has the key to his house?). Nice family.

I liked how Madison said "My father had it built for me." - like there was no human involved in the process, like it was a machine that made it appear, like things simply were done for her because she wanted them. Such a short simple sentence, and yet. And again I'm wondering if I'm seeing too much into things, where there's nothing. Here, at least, I can blame my lack of English, I hope.

I loved the description - "Now something quite remarkable (and Emmy worthy) happens" - was the actress who played Madison that good? Because I totally can see, in my mind's eyes, what the following description may look like, and I'm wondering if it's anything like what ended up on screen. Oh, and, of course, this proves beyond doubt that this little girl is as far from innocence as possible. At least there's a way to prove that she's lying, so she's not immune to mistakes, right?

I loved how Carla admired Rebecca for doing something that may be considered as really bad, scaring a child with a gun. I love it that Rebecca trusted her instinct enough to go along with it (would she have done it with a really innocent kid?), and that her lack of pulling-the-stops impressed another member of the team.

Boy, Web is tough. He knows for sure that Madison is lying in her accusations against Rebecca, and yet doesn't let Rebecca off the hook, not because of the possible law suit, but because of the compromising of the case. And then he wants her to continue, to prove that the girl is wrong, and without exchanging a word with her (and I don't believe he misremembered her age, either. He had a reason, of his own, to make sure Rebecca remembers, too, I think). Oh, and not even to approach the neighborhood, to top all that.

"You're asking me to climb a tree." - I imagine the actress saying it in my head, and loving it. I don't care what's the actual version sounded like. And I loved it that Rebecca - now that she can't go on her own - turned to her crew-mates for help, doing anything to solve the case (goodness, could something actually good come out of Web's game? Did he realize that they'd have to cooperate now and therefore the case wouldn't be compromised even in this situation?). And I love it that she asked Carla, just after their interaction before the conversation with Web, when Carla complimented her and tried to encourage her.

The episode, for me, is not about a murder mystery - again - but about the loss of a childhood. Rebecca's, obviously, and Henry's, who was also robbed of his life. But also of Madison's, by her own hands and mind. And maybe even Bunch's, the loss of his father (Henry also didn't get to see much of his father - we don't see him at all during the episode, right? and Paul's about to become a father). And maybe even Nora's childhood, too, in a way, I guess.

(continued...)


Nilly - Apr 30, 2006 10:35:45 am PDT #9741 of 10001
Swouncing

( continues...) And it seems like Web's tactic, of playing the crew against each other, works - they test each theory any of them makes, finds the flaws in it, trys to patch them or are willing to change their point of view. So it works. And obviously I can't tell if it were better to work as a team, to hash those ideas together instead of this way. At least I can tell it's easily more interesting this way for the character - and, again, it makes it more their stories than in any other "who did it" sort of show I can think of.

Oh, there are other knives, and they didn't find them at Bunch's place! So Madison still has them, right? But she's too clever to use them now that Bunch is locked up and she wants to keep her story? But if they manage to find them somewhere between her possessions, somewhere only she could put them, that would be what they're looking for, right?

Well, no, two missing. Maybe Madison will only use it to scare Nora?

Oh, twist! I was wondering what's going to be turned over (we can't know everything when we're still 10 pages behind the end, right?). And now I'm wondering what the broken-hearted mother may do. Oh, and there's another mention of a mother, with Bunch's mother. Hmm.

I love the game of blame and innocence - Rebecca told Ellen that she was innocent, that it wasn't her fault that her son was murdered. But in doing that, she started a chain of events that may make Ellen guilty of something else entirely. But then again, maybe not. I love it that I have no idea what Ellen may do.

Oh, it's a hearbreaking exchange - the not-false-anymore "I want my mommy", and the real "I want my son".

And I love it that Ellen can tell that Madison is lying. That she completely sees through her. Like Rebecca was able to. And I like it that Paul not only had the hardest time buying it, but admits it openly. The two different parents.

I loved it that Paul smashed through the security arm in order to get inside with Rebecca. It brought to mind the lines in front of the security at the very beginning of the episode, at the FBI building, with all of them entering with their cards while talking, while everybody else had to wait in a longer line, only in reverse. I loved it that Paul wanted Rebecca there with him.

I loved it that before we could see what happened at the pool (obviously, the pool, with the splashing sound, just like at the beginning), I had no idea who had done what, who was hurt and by whom and how much. It could be either of the three, both as an attacker and as a victim. And Tessa wasn't an illogical choice - she was a mother just like Ellen, right?

And I loved the description of the knife falling - it wasn't the murder weapon, it was innocent in this scenario, despite everything.

"She exhales a breath she s probably been holding for a very long time." - that's a beautiful description.

And I loved the "children' conversation at the end - the old mother who got her grown-up kid back, the worry that never ends, even when the child is no longer a child, the constant wish to protect your loved ones, even when they're taller and stronger than you. And I loved Carla's line about protecting the parents from the kids, not just in the horrible sense of this episode, but in general - the aches of raising a child, of changing, of realizing you can't defend them, no matter how hard you try, how you're bound to be hurt by them, no matter how hard they try.

And I loved it that ultimately, it was Paul's story, at the end, like it was his revelation at the beginning (even though I really like the character of Web, even though Rebecca was the one who understood about who was a monster and who wasn't, even though I like the banter between Carla and Danny). The wish to protect, but also the wander about the possibilities of that baby that is growing inside his wife right now. Can you protect somebody from himself? Can somebody be born bad?

I love it that a seemingly-"let's solve the crime" show made my think about that. So, once again, Kristen? You totally rock.


Tim Minear - Apr 30, 2006 1:04:52 pm PDT #9742 of 10001
"Don' be e-scared"

How nice to read your thoughts, Nilly! FYI, the different colors on the scripts represent each time I made a revision. We insert a different color page for each new set of revisions to keep track.


planbee - Apr 30, 2006 6:08:56 pm PDT #9743 of 10001
I don't think anyone really cares as long as it works.

Each time I finish the finale, I can't stop obsessing about what's next for Rebecca. And how would the Rebecca/Paul angst finally play out?

I find that I'm rewatching the Inside more than Wonderfalls and Firefly combined. Every single piece clicked for me. It's extremely rare that I get along so well with television, especially a FOX show.

Thanks Tim.


tiggy - Apr 30, 2006 6:17:53 pm PDT #9744 of 10001
I do believe in killing the messenger, you know why? Because it sends a message. ~ Damon Salvatore

I actually just got around to watching the finale of The Inside this afternoon. it was fantastic. probably one of my favorite eps. i, too, wonder what was next for Rebecca. stupid FUX.


msbelle - Apr 30, 2006 7:29:21 pm PDT #9745 of 10001
I remember the crazy days. 500 posts an hour. Nubmer! Natgbsb

so I did none of those crafts projects I mentioned earlier. I did however start frogging an old sweater, only to find out that I think it was machine knitted and yarn was twisted throughout to eliminate fraying. It is not so much an unraveling job as an unweaving maze.


Allyson - Apr 30, 2006 7:32:10 pm PDT #9746 of 10001
Wait, is this real-world child support, where the money goes to buy food for the kids, or MRA fantasyland child support where the women just buy Ferraris and cocaine? -Jessica

Oooh. msbelle, my mom wants a new sewing machine for mother's day, and my dad, brother, and SIL said they'd pitch in with me to buy one.

Her old machine was a relic passed down from her mom, and it finally kicked the bucket.

Any suggestions?


msbelle - Apr 30, 2006 7:39:09 pm PDT #9747 of 10001
I remember the crazy days. 500 posts an hour. Nubmer! Natgbsb

Allyson I do not know anything about new machines. Mine are both old. I can ask my mom though.