so I'm stuck in exile with preachers in bad suits, Tom DeLay, and a room full of Thomas Kinkade paintings and a buffet table full of tragic casseroles you would find on Iron Chef: Battle Condensed Cream of Mushroom Soup.

Oh, this is effin' brilliant.

I have a question for the Catholics -- can a person use something that has the side effect of birth control if that is not its purpose -- i.e. estrogen can be prescribed for a variety of problems, but would have the effect of preventing pregnancy. Is that allowed?

He just doesn't get a "He had to! He felt really bad about it!" from me.

I don't think anyone (here) insisted he felt really bad about it. But the had to ... well, mandatory things while you're a teen? I'll go with he pretty much had to.

I have a question for the Catholics -- can a person use something that has the side effect of birth control if that is not its purpose -- i.e. estrogen can be prescribed for a variety of problems, but would have the effect of preventing pregnancy. Is that allowed?

I know that in Catholic hospitals that's what doctors have to do -- they can't prescribe birth control, but they can give the Pill for "irregular periods" or some such.

I stopped being surprised that close exposure to one injustice (like, say, racism) doesn't cure people of honestly believing something I consider a similar injustice (like, say, homophobia). I don't mark folk down for that, or up for the converse. I consider them independently.

Yes, this is a good point.

Also, I'm not sure I find his statements about other churches, as the protector of orthodoxy of his church, so offensive. I'm willing to be convinced, however.

To wit: In 1997 Ratzinger annoyed Buddhists by calling their religion an "autoerotic spirituality’" that offers "transcendence without imposing concrete religious obligations." And Hinduism, he said, offers "false hope"; it guarantees purification based on a "morally cruel" concept of reincarnation resembling "a continuous circle of hell." The Cardinal predicted Buddhism would replace Marxism as the Catholic Church’s main enemy this century.

Predicting one religion would become an enemy? Offensive. Stating that a religion offers no concrete religious obligations or that reincarnation would be like hell? Doesn't offend me. I'm not going to be more offended at him than at other cardinals because he doesn't have a good opinion of other religions. I think that's a given. The Catholic church has always been political.

I read that he deserted the German army towards the end of the war. Which was somewhat ballsy, as at that point deserters were usually shot on sight or else hanged publicly as an example.

I know that in Catholic hospitals that's what doctors have to do -- they can't prescribe birth control, but they can give the Pill for "irregular periods" or some such.

right. when I had fibroids, my doctor told me that the first course of treatment was birth control pills. Not being used for contraceptive purposes, is that okay?

Not being used for contraceptive purposes, is that okay?

Yes. At least, that is my understanding of the way Catholic hospitals generally work. I have a friend who went to a Catholic medical school, and she still learned how to do abortions, but it had to be written up VERY carefully.

By not applying the idea of creating an "other" to hate being a bad thing to the groups he marginalizes.

Do you think he's creating an "other" to hate, or that he's preaching the doctrine he believes is true. I'm not Catholic, and don't plan to become one, so I have nothing personal at stake in this conversation, as there is plenty of Roman Catholic doctrine I feel is in error. And that's kind of my point, I guess. I am not a Catholic, and I could go through the Catechism, if I could be arsed to do so, and tell you where I think Catholic doctrine is wrong. Would that make me a hater, or one who promotes hate? How is it different from what we're doing now (except of course, that we're only talking to each other--and don't have the attention of the world--yet).

This was an Xpost of the --I was very much trying to say what bon bon said, so much better-- variety.

He can't have said autoerotic. That's just icky. But I'd love to see him explain why Hinduism offers more false hope than Christianity. And more cruel concepts.