Mal ,'Objects In Space'
Is it better the second time around? Or the third? Or tenth? This is the place to come when you have a burning desire to talk about an old episode that was just re-run.
Fortuitous timing--I'm reading a review of the S2 DVDs, and saw this:
Willow entrusts Xander with the task of relaying this message to Buffy. Let’s just say, some of us are still waiting for its delivery. Xander had one moment to be a person, to keep a promise to his best friend and potentially save the life of Buffy’s love. He fails on every count. Did I mention, he’s not a morally-challenged vampire?
Not that I agree with the sentiment. I agree with Nutty and Hec.
FWIW, I totally agree with the reviewer. Xander done wrong. Doesn't mean he's evil, but humans do wrong. You admit it, you ask forgiveness and you promise to never do it again. And that is where Xander failed, in my eye. He never owned up.
He never owned up.
Yeah, I don't know. They really glossed over Giles' betrayal in "Helpless" by having him re-earn Buffy's respect off-screen during "The Zeppo."
Giles' almost got Buffy and her Mom killed by his direct actions. I don't see Xander's Lie as being nearly as bad or unambiguous. It was a grey area act of omission. Giles and Willow committed much worse betrayals as acts of comission, but fans wear their Favorite Goggles and that's how they view the show.
You're right, Hec. But right now, we're talking Xander and Willow and I think Xander has offended against Buffy more than Willow. Giles we'll save for another time. I gots beef with Giles. Specially season 7.
Giles' almost got Buffy and her Mom killed by his direct actions. I don't see Xander's Lie as being nearly as bad or unambiguous. It was a grey area act of omission. Giles and Willow committed much worse betrayals as acts of comission, but fans wear their Favorite Goggles and that's how they view the show.
Well, Giles was also doing His Job, in theory for an organized Greater Good, which makes something of a difference to me. Plus, the fallout of his actions brought us Wesley, so it's all good.
As for the lie, sure, it wasn't a physical act, but it wasn't an act of omission. He lied, flat out. Made something up. Told an untruth. Committed a falsehood. An act of omission would have been not saying that Willow said anything.
You're right, Hec. But right now, we're talking Xander and Willow and I think Xander has offended against Buffy more than Willow.
Assuming, of course, that trying to destroy the world is inoffensive.
Yeah, I gotta say, Willow wins that competition hands down, between the trying to destroy the world and the memory-wiping.
One can make a distinction of against Buffy, though. Xander did something to Buffy. Willow? Batshit trying to kill everyone. Sure, she tried to lay the smackdown on Buff, but it wasn't as simply personal as what Xander did.
Yeah, but Willow directly endangered Dawn's life (which, I think, is a bigger deal to Buffy than her own life at that point) during the Magic is Crack storyline.
One can make a distinction of against Buffy, though.
Raising Buffy from the dead, even with the best of (conscious) intentions, messed Buffy up pretty seriously. The memory wipe of TR was also aimed at Buffy -- again, with supposedly good intentions (though here I'd say Willow was thinking at least in part of easing Willow's conscience) -- though with unpleasant results.