Not a vamp though.

true, but your question was "Who was ugly and hated?" If you want an ugly vamp, I'll give you Dalton in Surprise.

Also, Kakistos and whoever the vamp was in Helpless (is that the episode where Giles puts Buffy through the cruci-whatever-it-is ritual? Dear lord I'm rocking a huge case of medicine head + sleep dep today) Some of the shempires were gnarly.

actually, now that think about it, the Vessel was no cover boy, either

the Vessel

Luke, right, in WttHM? Damn, I really need to do a re-watch. I'm actually fogetting stuff I didn't even have to think about.

eta Like how to spell "forgetting" for example.

Luke, right, in WttHM?

Yes, his name escaped me, but I knew that someone would know it.

true, but your question was "Who was ugly and hated?" If you want an ugly vamp, I'll give you Dalton in Surprise.

I was responding directly to Marster's comment about Joss' attitude towards vampires, which I attempted to refute. The comment was:

Every character on the show was a version of Joss, but Joss didn't see Spike that way. Spike was the other guy. He was the guy who might mess up the show, actually, because vampires are supposed to be ugly and hated. emphasis mine

It just struck me as an odd comment from an actor who gained 'pretty boy' status from playing a character that Joss wrote.

I'm reading subtext into it that may not be there, but it seems as if JM felt under appreciated for the contribution he brought to what was originally planned as a 'throwaway' character. In the commentaries and interviews I've seen, Joss seemed to actively value Spike's development...aka, Marster's spin on him.

Yeah, I'm reading that same sort of subtext too, Beej, and I'm pretty surprised. Joss seemed to love Spike, from what I could tell.

Well, vampires are ugly when they are being their most demonic in their vampire face rather than their human face - perhaps that is what they meant.

I didn't think he was being metaphorical.

Bolding mine:

Angel was an exception too, but Angel wasn't Joss' idea and I think by the time I came on, he was afraid that these good-looking vampires were going to take over the theme. So whenever Joss would write an episode, Spike would have, like, five lines. [Laughs]

Like, for example, in "School Hard," "Lie to Me," and "Becoming," in which Spike probably had almost as much dialogue as the show's eponymous lead? Dude, show not named Spike.

I do hope Marti Noxon gets him a regular role on GA though, lessening the chance that he'll guest star and take over in Fonzie-esque fashioncatch on in a show that I watch.