Don't worry, we're sure to spot Faith first. She's like this cleavagy slut-bomb walking around 'Ooh, check me out, I'm wicked-cool, I'm five-by-five.'

Willow ,'Get It Done'


Buffy and Angel 1: BUFFYNANGLE4EVA!!!!!1!

Is it better the second time around? Or the third? Or tenth? This is the place to come when you have a burning desire to talk about an old episode that was just re-run.


Fred Pete - Aug 09, 2005 9:03:16 am PDT #1760 of 10458
Ann, that's a ferret.

Willow's key arguments were "We need her," and "She's being tormented in a hell dimension." The first was true (but that doesn't mean it was sufficient to justify bringing Buffy back).

So if she was being manipulative, it was on the hell dimension argument. And that's possible. Willow should have known that there were a lot of dimensions out there, and not all of them were hell-y (remember the "world without shrimp"?).

Xander, and Tara to a lesser extent, may have bought Willow's argument -- and Xander in particular may have made the decision first and sought the reason later. But Anya definitely should have seen the logical flaw in Willow's argument -- she's had first-hand experience of "many dimensions."


Connie Neil - Aug 09, 2005 9:04:50 am PDT #1761 of 10458
brillig

Maybe nto tamper with Xander, so much, but I don't buy shyness and a habit of conceding to Willow as sufficient to make Tara willing to do a resurrection--especially after Tara was so adamant about the wrongness of bringing back Joyce. I wonder if it got out that Dawn did it anyway and how. I don't see Tara conceding a major moral point just to make Willow stop pouting.


Vortex - Aug 09, 2005 9:07:03 am PDT #1762 of 10458
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman

ust parroting my earlier comment that I think Tara's lines in "Bargaining" made it pretty clear that she had a good idea how dangerous and wrong their plans re; Buffy were, and chose to hop on the tombstone-rolling bandwagon anyway.

I also think that Tara wanted desperately to fit in, and arguing against bringing Buffy back would have been counter productive.


Typo Boy - Aug 09, 2005 9:07:19 am PDT #1763 of 10458
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

I acknowledge all the arguments about Willow. It was that until the addiction thing which started with the Tara mind-wipe, I did not care. Basically it took the mind-wipe to shock me out of Willow worship.


Scrappy - Aug 09, 2005 9:09:35 am PDT #1764 of 10458
Life moves pretty fast. You don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.

Also it's crapshoot with bringing Buffy back. We know that a certain percentage of other dimensions are unspeakably horrible. We also know this one isn't. So do we leave Buffy someplace ont he hope that it's NOT horrible, or bring her back where we KNOW she'll be okay?


Katie M - Aug 09, 2005 9:09:45 am PDT #1765 of 10458
I was charmed (albeit somewhat perplexed) by the fannish sensibility of many of the music choices -- it's like the director was trying to vid Canada. --loligo on the Olympic Opening Ceremonies

So if she was being manipulative, it was on the hell dimension argument.

I don't see any reason to think that she was lying here. Not thinking things through, sure; not thinking as she should about the possible negative consequences of what she did, definitely; but I think her intentions were good.


Vortex - Aug 09, 2005 9:17:24 am PDT #1766 of 10458
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman

So do we leave Buffy someplace ont he hope that it's NOT horrible, or bring her back where we KNOW she'll be okay?

I think that the definition of "okay" is relative. She'll still be the Slayer, still putting her life in danger every day.

Although, I think that it was not a baseless assumption that Buffy was in a hell dimension. She died closing the door to one, so it wasn't unreasonable to think that she might have ended up there.


Vortex - Aug 09, 2005 9:18:04 am PDT #1767 of 10458
"Cry havoc and let slip the boobs of war!" -- Miracleman

but I think her intentions were good.

you know what the say about the road to a hell dimension . . .


DavidS - Aug 09, 2005 9:20:16 am PDT #1768 of 10458
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

I don't see any reason to think that she was lying here. Not thinking things through, sure; not thinking as she should about the possible negative consequences of what she did, definitely; but I think her intentions were good.

Concur.

Although, I think that it was not a baseless assumption that Buffy was in a hell dimension. She died closing the door to one, so it wasn't unreasonable to think that she might have ended up there.

Concur.

Also, Anya did have reservations about the resurrection but frankly didn't care that much that it was WRONG.


tiggy - Aug 09, 2005 9:22:44 am PDT #1769 of 10458
I do believe in killing the messenger, you know why? Because it sends a message. ~ Damon Salvatore

I think Willow honestly believed that Buffy was in a hell dimension and really it makes sense. anytime someone was sent to another dimension, it was a hell-like existence. though you could also argue that when that happened their bodies were taken as well and Buffy's wasn't.

I think they all had a bit of "hellmouth on the brain" when thinking it out. it doesn't even cross their mind that Buffy had paid her dues and could quite possibly be getting rewarded with heaven.