I heard ita's coming out of Monica Lewinski's POV. How scary is *that*?

Oh, my gracious. Deb, I can always count on you for a POV I hadn't considered. Thank you for that.

Interesting that you look for something to mitigate the harshness. Do you think that comes from a gender neutral viewpoint?

I don't really know. It might be just from reading it too casually the first time.

On first read, I came away thinking "Yeah, false modesty or salt in the wound, annoying either way," and puzzling over what the connection to an "in crowd" might be. Never occurred to me that someone would apologize for success and be sincere.

Your comment to Steph gave me the "in crowd" connection I had missed, and on re-read it occurred to me that if I imagined the characters as opposite sex the last line came across much more harshly than if I imagined them the same sex.

Shows my biases.

Well, and that's why 100 words either sometimes isn't enough (for my writing) or the drabble just doesn't work as I hoped. I confess to being a tad less than sober when I wrote it and with very hurt feelings, so as the insider writing it, I thought it was clear as a bell. However, a number of readers (both male and female) couldn't see it so, meh. Didn't work as well as I hoped, but did purge some of the hurt so it accomplished it's purpose, at the least. Plus, provoked some very interesting dialog over gender perceptions.

Yeah, no problem perceiving that the apologizers is a woman, but could not tell that the guy was angry at the demonstrated skill/intelligence rather than the apologizing.

The In Crowd

Another year, another school; this time I’m eating lunch with the In Crowd. Why they deigned me worthy doesn’t matter, I’ll enjoy it while it lasts. Who knows what the next school will think of me.

Mid-school year, Kristy arrived, looking lost and nervous. She was kind and intelligent so I dragged her over to eat lunch with my “friends”. Rachel took one look at Kristy and said, “No.”

I made a choice that day to leave the In Crowd rather than make Kristy a complete outcast. Too bad she was the only one that moved away the following year.

Never occurred to me that someone would apologize for success and be sincere.

Good heavens, yes. Women are trained to do that in American society; be humble, be modest, have great aspirations but for heavens sake don't say what you think too loudly or you'll risk never getting a boyfriend. I was only vaguely aware of that in my own teens, since I got to the US at age 9, but I raised a daughter and became aware of it then. It's pervasive in this society.

Nicole, I loved that.

Good heavens, yes. Women are trained to do that in American society; be humble, be modest

Is it really a woman thing? I don't think I've been "trained" but I'm having massive issues right now describing why I was able to earn enough trust to collect money and run campaigns. Involves "bragging."

I found a way around it be discussing social capital, which puts me a degree outside, if that makes any sense. Talking about myself in a clinical way is helping. Otherwise it all sounds like, "look, I'm awesome."

You are awesome, Allyson. It isn't bragging if it's true.

I do think that men are more likely to say "I did a great job" than women are.

Is it really a woman thing? I don't think I've been "trained" but I'm having massive issues right now describing why I was able to earn enough trust to collect money and run campaigns. Involves "bragging."

Yep. It honestly is. Part of the backlash to feminism in this country is purely entrenched in that - "Hey, they demanded the right to play sports and get equal pay and get as a good an education! We only gave it to them because we knew they wouldn't be as good at this stuff as we were! What the hell do you mean, they are as good? STOP THAT!"

The scenario of the adolescent girl - "Marsha, Marsha, Marsha!" - who comes home weeping because the boys don't like her, and is tactfully told by her parents to play dumber than she is or less gifted than she is or not able to play tennis or softball or whatever better than the boys because 'boys don't like girls who are too (insert skill set)" is as old as the American sitcom.

Thing is, they didn't pull that gestalt out of their asses. It made its way onto TV screens for decades, literally, because it was there to be mined and used in the first place. I don't know how many parents in America still tell their daughters that stuff, but they may not even need to. The vibe is in the air we breathe, and it horrifies me, as a woman and as a parent.

The scary thing, from my own perspective is, how defensive women get about being smart. I've never had the slightest problem saying "Yep, I write better than at least 95% of the writers I've met. Of course, my suckness at math is at the same level." And I get as much flak from a lot of women I know for not being ashamed of sucking at math as I do from a lot of the men for not being humble about how well I write.

I don't know. People are weird. But I do think it's a gender issue, on the societal level.

Thing is, they didn't pull that gestalt out of their asses. It made its way onto TV screens for decades, literally, because it was there to be mined and used in the first place. I don't know how many parents in America still tell their daughters that stuff, but they may not even need to. The vibe is in the air we breathe, and it horrifies me, as a woman and as a parent.

Oh, how I hate to reference Oprah, but she did a show a few weeks ago with Pink, about her song "Stupid Girl". It's Pink's reaction to girls who are all about being sexy over smart and strong, girls who think that having their breasts enlarged is more important than whether or not they're going to college.

I felt the whole "act dumb for the boys" thing growing up. Not from my parents (my mom was valedictorian, and my dad didn't finish college, so me being smart was important to them in different ways) but just...in the air.