what is the point of an unended ending? Are we supposed to think there's a possibility of survival? Is it to suggest that the ending is just too depressing/sad/whatever to be viewed, so they're "drawing a veil" over it?

IMO, because it doesn't matter if they win or lose. What matters is that they keep fighting.

tina, that's right! I remember. And then you basically had to go through the hellmouth (or a little misunderstanding with the Police) to watch, didn't you? I'm so glad you stayed around!

Yep, Cindy, and I don't think I would have kept posting if it wasn't for you. I expected to just post and go back to lurkdom but you asked me how I got into Buffy and found the Buffistas and it felt, you know, rude, to not answer : ). I blame this all on you. Then I had to come back and tell the "I-got-arrested-in-the-middle-of-the-finale story."

And don't think I wasn't watching the door a bit through this finale expecting the police to show up and cart me away. I made sure I was traffic violation-free a week ago - but I thought maybe getting arrested during Jossverse finales was going to become my "thing."

I missed the credits at the end - how did Joss' name come up in a surprising way?

Oh - and add me to the stunned, broken, loved-ever-second-of-it list. I am so sad - but so happy that Angel and crew (minus Wes sob) got to go out fighting.

I want a t-shirt with all of Ilyria's lines on them! "I will bring back their spines as trophies." I love her.

I so screamed "CONNOR!!" when he showed up during the Not!Jayne and Angel fight. That along with wearing my Sunnydale High t-shirt, consuming almost a whole bottle of wine by the end of teaser, screaming "kiss, kiss!!" during almost ever scene in Smallville w/ Clark and Lex and crying no less than three times during the Angle finale convinced all of my casual-but-still-devoted Angel watching friends that I do really need serious help.

I figured that Angel ordered Lorne to kill Lindsey. And that is the only human I can ever remember Lorne even harming - so I would guess that pushed his depressed ass right over the edge.

back to catching up

I missed the credits at the end - how did Joss' name come up in a surprising way?

I believe they were referring to the quick cut from Angel taking his first swing at 1 of 30,000 to "Executive Producer Joss Whedon".

(Hey, I'm still not asleep.)

how did Joss' name come up in a surprising way?

Immediately following the line "I kinda want to slay the dragon," they cut to the white-on-black "Executive Producer Joss Whedon" card. Surprised me too.

on a metaphoric level the stuggle continues, because it's our struggle.

I suppose. I have little patience, though, for metaphor trumping plot. I know the good fight goes on, we must all do our part, etc. Heck, Angel did a speech to that effect. To cut it off just as the fight starts or the car goes off the road or whatever smacks of Saturday serial cliffhangers. If they want to go artsy, do a slo-mo of them diving into the fight, slowly going down one at a time, then Angel on his own at the end, not giving up till they physically drag him down. Maybe a Lorne voice-over musing on the deaths of heros.

I have this picture in my head of The Alley of Doom filled with scores of corpses - orcs (or whatever. I don't get good enough reception to have seen what-all showed up to fight), a dragon, and the broken bodies of Gunn, Illyria, and Spike.

Just popping in to say GUH! and note that the previously breakdown (the last) is now up in Mejiaville. I'm working on the WB "THANK YOU" (fuck them), but I appear to have caught a cold and need to get some sleep. I'll try to post it tomorrow.

As for how the episode ended, in theory I would be against how they did it (I like closure and don't like "everybody dies" as an ending in general), but tonight's didn't bother me at all. I loved the episode.

butting in without catching up to say:

that. was. awesome.

"Personally, I want to fight a dragon".

sniff

heading back to catch up.

Broken. Show broke me.

I despise the Butch and Sundance ending of them roaring off into hopeless battle.

It's not hopeless if they win.

I may have yelled "Have sex with me now!" "Oh, no you're not!" and most definitely "But that's not fair!!!!"

I don't have much of a rational response. I hate that Wesley died and that Gunn is ten minutes away from buying the farm and Angel's still standing. I hate that he may have had Lindsey shot.

I don't hate the episode, let me be clear.

I was really peacable about it ending, until 8:56. Then I got antsy, and poured some Ollalawhateverberry wine.

I was pretty okay, mellow, laughing, until the poetry slam, and I realised how sincerely they were going for their last days (or not), and how bleak this was going to be.

I shall repeat "they have a cave troll" to myself to see if it makes me feel better.