I missed the credits at the end - how did Joss' name come up in a surprising way?

I believe they were referring to the quick cut from Angel taking his first swing at 1 of 30,000 to "Executive Producer Joss Whedon".

(Hey, I'm still not asleep.)

how did Joss' name come up in a surprising way?

Immediately following the line "I kinda want to slay the dragon," they cut to the white-on-black "Executive Producer Joss Whedon" card. Surprised me too.

on a metaphoric level the stuggle continues, because it's our struggle.

I suppose. I have little patience, though, for metaphor trumping plot. I know the good fight goes on, we must all do our part, etc. Heck, Angel did a speech to that effect. To cut it off just as the fight starts or the car goes off the road or whatever smacks of Saturday serial cliffhangers. If they want to go artsy, do a slo-mo of them diving into the fight, slowly going down one at a time, then Angel on his own at the end, not giving up till they physically drag him down. Maybe a Lorne voice-over musing on the deaths of heros.

I have this picture in my head of The Alley of Doom filled with scores of corpses - orcs (or whatever. I don't get good enough reception to have seen what-all showed up to fight), a dragon, and the broken bodies of Gunn, Illyria, and Spike.

Just popping in to say GUH! and note that the previously breakdown (the last) is now up in Mejiaville. I'm working on the WB "THANK YOU" (fuck them), but I appear to have caught a cold and need to get some sleep. I'll try to post it tomorrow.

As for how the episode ended, in theory I would be against how they did it (I like closure and don't like "everybody dies" as an ending in general), but tonight's didn't bother me at all. I loved the episode.

butting in without catching up to say:

that. was. awesome.

"Personally, I want to fight a dragon".

sniff

heading back to catch up.

Broken. Show broke me.

I despise the Butch and Sundance ending of them roaring off into hopeless battle.

It's not hopeless if they win.

I may have yelled "Have sex with me now!" "Oh, no you're not!" and most definitely "But that's not fair!!!!"

I don't have much of a rational response. I hate that Wesley died and that Gunn is ten minutes away from buying the farm and Angel's still standing. I hate that he may have had Lindsey shot.

I don't hate the episode, let me be clear.

I was really peacable about it ending, until 8:56. Then I got antsy, and poured some Ollalawhateverberry wine.

I was pretty okay, mellow, laughing, until the poetry slam, and I realised how sincerely they were going for their last days (or not), and how bleak this was going to be.

I shall repeat "they have a cave troll" to myself to see if it makes me feel better.

the finale could have been a two-hour thing... but it was a great send off... and the "Your Friends at The WB" at the end... uh, my ass WB.

the ending was great.. I want more but then it just made me hate The WB a little more... actually a lot more.. I'll rewatch... now.

I liked how it ended. The little bit of uncertainty.

Also on a practical note - plenty of room to let anyone they want survive if they need to for a future series or TV movie - with only minor asspulls.

Having seen it I'm absolutely certain Lorne killed Lindsey on Angel's orders. The bitterness , the "one last thing", Angel knowing Lindsey was not coming back.

Lorne was always on Angels side because of friendship - not because he was deeply committed to good in the "good vs. evil " thing. But Lindsey was a friend too - obviously not as good a one as Angel, but a friend nonetheless. Yeah killing a friend for the cause would make anyone bitter - but especially Lorne. So totally against everything he is - and yet in character for him to do it under the circumstances. And hate himself, and hate Angel for it afterwords.