Second tier scoobs being Anya and Andrew and I loved the episodes that focused on them.

I'd add Spike (there was too much, but still some good moments), Faith and Prinicpal Wood in there. Yeah, they didn't do much with Dawn either but that was, sadly, not a new development.

There may be bungee cords involved though.

You forget, she only tops.

Well that was the whole problem with season 7 in a nutshell. I mean, the potentials were the most obvious example, but on the whole, down to my beloved Buffy herself, it was too much static to noise. The potentials took away from the established cast. The second stringers of the established cast took away from the core four. The core four could have been any random people with those names. Characterization took a nose dive. And Buffy took away from herself. The missed opportunities (like the FE appearing as Buffy and tricking others) were glaring. There was confusion that didn't add to anything in the end (Memorex!Giles, and Memorex!Joyce!FE).

Hec pretty much said what I wanted, with the exception that The Girl In Question in its deliberate hamfisted rape of the mythos, is singlehandedly worse than any 5 of the worst Buffy episodes.

Buffy was never boring, even when it was bad. Angel I found - and this is where I think Lost is going to lose me, btw - monotone. It was always on the same note of despair livened with wackiness. And it rarely connected with real emotional scenarios like Buffy did.

By coincidence, lately I've been thinking about how S7 Buffy could have been saved. A few thoughts in random order, some no doubt quite radical....

(1) Dust Spike in S6. I've said it before, but I still believe that he should not have survived "Seeing Red." Maybe even "As You Were."

(2) Don't dump all the Potentials on us at once. Or even give us only 3 or 4 potentials. In other words, give 'em to us gradually, or make 'em few enough, that we get to know and care about them. Keep Amanda.

(3) In the same vein, keep Willow and Kennedy apart. Or if you have to give Willow a new GF, make it UST for a while. Or at least make Willow feel some guilt over "betraying" Tara.

(4) Since we've gotten rid of Spike, drop the "Principal Wood's mother was a Slayer" story. But keep Principal Wood. Maybe as a well-meaning, competent principal who really doesn't get what's going on. (If that isn't too much of a cross between Principal Flutie and Joyce.)

(5) In fact, focus more on Sunnydale High. OK, Buffy's job was a bit of an asspull, but it carried the potential for some good storylines -- "high school is hell" seen from the other side. (Come on, "Help" was at least a good, solid standalone.) Also gives Dawn, and maybe Xander, something to do.

(6) Keep Andrew (I liked his journey), but remember that he grew up some in "Storyteller."

(7) Dump the inspirational speeches. Or at least show (other than the brief moment in "Storyteller") that nobody took them seriously.

(8) Dump the "is-he-or-isn't-he-FE!Giles" meme.

The only real drawback I see is who holds the amulet during the final battle.

Buffy was never boring, even when it was bad. Angel I found - and this is where I think Lost is going to lose me, btw - monotone. It was always on the same note of despair livened with wackiness. And it rarely connected with real emotional scenarios like Buffy did.

YMMV, very obviously. I found AtS more emotionally real than much of BtVS, esp. the last half of the BtVS run.

I found AtS more emotionally real than much of BtVS, esp. the last half of the BtVS run.

As usual in these matters, Plei is me.

You're a Buffista who thinks Buffy season 1 is the best, right Matt?

Yes, though really I think Season 2 was essentially as good quality-wise and it was just the freshness of Season 1 that made me fonder. Season 3 wasn't far behind, with only the melodrama of the Buffy/Angel romance that had outlived its time striking a sour note.

I guess I see the potentials as a bad idea, Crack!Willow as a brief wrong turn (since her flipping evil was fun), and Saint Cordy a betrayal.

Unsurprisingly, I agree with ita and Hec here. Buffy Season 7 kind of spread the suckitude out all over the storyline rather than concentrating it in one character arc. It caused me to feel bored and somewhat sad that the writers couldn't do better, rather than hurt and betrayed that they were destroying something I loved.

The only real drawback I see is who holds the amulet during the final battle.

Angel. Fulfills all the same dramatic needs, only better. Eliminates the WTF?!?-ness of sending him away from the final battle to prepare a second line rather than maximizing their chances right off the bat. Makes for an interesting summer speculating what's going to happen on his show. Then Angel Season 5 begins with Wesley, Gunn, Fred, and Lorne stuck at Wolfram & Hart trying to salvage their mission and opening the resurrection-gram at the end of the episode. I don't think Spike's absence would have been a bad thing at all, though they would have needed different stories to tell in "Destiny" and "Soul Purpose."

I just saw this linked over at TWoP:

AICN's Herc's Top Ten Hourlong Scripted Shows of 2004:

Herc is a huge fan of Angel S5--it's #1 (Lost is 2, Wonderfalls is 3).

Heh. He seems to have a higher opinion of "The Girl In Question" than most folks hereabouts...

including four astonishing five-star episodes: “A Hole in the World” (Fred bids Wes goodbye), Underneath (Hamilton, the new Wolfram & Hart liaison, arrives), “The Girl in Question” (Angel and Spike learn Buffy Summers has moved on) and “Not Fade Away” (Wesley Wyndam-Pryce shuffles off his mortal coil).