But how do they find out you were lying without you being guilty of something worth tossing you out for anyway? They can turf you for conspiracy, can't the?

Say they come across a membership list with your name on it. They can just boot you for lying on the form and not have any picky-ass "trial". Hell, they can clear out half a dozen other dudes with the same name.

Or, you know, ship you to Gitmo.

Yeah, I'm thinking if they recognize your name/picture as someone on the State Department's "Evil: Do not give visa to" list, charging you with filling out a form wrong isn't going to be necessary.

The DMV in Boston has gotten somewhat civilized. You take a number and sit on benches until your number appears on a big screen.

The Hollywood branch is like this too.

I loved Nilly's line story. It was beautiful.

Well, if you lie on the form they can boot you out for that even if you haven't actually blown anything up.

And the flip side of this is, if you didn't lie on the form, and for whatever reason they let you in anyway, it's much much harder to get you booted out later if they decide they have cause. A lot of ex-Nazis were allowed into the US in the late 40s-50s, avowed they were ex-Nazis on their immigration forms, and then when the world got around to extraditing/prosecuting some 30, 40, 50 years later, the extradition and citizenship-stripping (?) trials were extremely unpleasant and slow.

DMV in SF is painless; call for an appointment and zero waiting, or do your business entirely online, rather than in line.

Huh. Down here in the Valley, it's call for an appointment and *get to wait in a shorter line*. Seriously. There's an Appointments line.

Betsy, I swear, an appointment at the Fell Street DMV? I've done four of them now, and the only line is the check-in.

Total wait, with an appointment, from walking in, including the check-in line? Six minutes.

I can deal with that.

YAY Nilly is on her way to being on her way!!

Yeah to Nilly coming!

I thought I'd share that I used to be the person on the other side of the window interviewing the people (in Brazil). It's funny to hear someone's perception of being on the other side of the bullet-proof glass. Working on the inside was almost as unpleasant as being interviewed, I think. Our lines used to go around the building, inside and out. Hours of telling people they didn't qualify, not enough ties to their country, etc.

They are supposed to tell you at the window whether they approve your visa or not, but FWIW, I can't imagine they won't approve Nilly's visa.

The Canadian consulate in Detroit doesn't tell you right away. It's not three days, not for Jamaicans, but they do take your passport away, and you have to come back and get it.

Travel is hard.

I've gotten in heated discussions with some people that embody the Rude American stereotype, and I wondered if the ease of gaining access to foreign countries made them feel more like they hadn't even left, so why bother dress modestly or take their shoes off before going into a place of worship? But sometimes, having sweated blood to get within borders, you could very well feel owed.

So it's probably just a Rude thing.

I think most Americans feel they are entitled to go anywhere they want. I think it's part good - growing up with freedom - and part sense of entitlement.

Brazil requires Americans to have a visa. About once a month, when I worked there, we'd get a call from some outraged American stuck at immigration demanding that we force the Brazilian government to let them in. The whole idea of "their country, their rules" seemed pretty lost on most of them.