I like money better than people. People can so rarely be exchanged for goods and/or services!

Willow ,'Showtime'


We're Literary 2: To Read Makes Our Speaking English Good  

There's more to life than watching Buffy the Vampire Slayer! No. Really, there is! Honestly! Here's a place for Buffistas to come and discuss what it is they're reading, their favorite authors and poets. "Geez. Crack a book sometime."


Sophia Brooks - Nov 22, 2005 6:46:55 pm PST #9580 of 10002
Cats to become a rabbit should gather immediately now here

Libba Bray's A Great and Terribly Beauty

Is Yeats the most referenced poet ever? Or do I just know more Yeats than other poets?


DavidS - Nov 23, 2005 5:55:14 am PST #9581 of 10002
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

Is Yeats the most referenced poet ever?

Shakespeare, surely. Although I have seen about five books in the last ten years that steal from Morrissey for their titles.


Nutty - Nov 27, 2005 4:28:57 pm PST #9582 of 10002
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."

Hey all. I just finished Mary Doria Russell's latest, entitled A Thread of Grace. I probably could have guessed that it would be subpar from that subpar title, but about thirty pages in I realized I was basically reading War and Remembrance in Liguria. So I read it all the way through, but got about as much value out of it as I did out of War and Remembrance -- cast of thousands, treacly dedications, killings-off according to the need for bloodbath, editorial ponderings of how evil Hitler was, symbolic blah-blah.

(I mean, duh, in a novel published sixty years later, do we really need to state that Hitler sucked? Can you tell I never watch those OMG what happened to Hitler's fingernail clippings?!? shows on the History Channel?)

And unlike Herman Wouk (or Leon Uris, who is better), Russell can't or won't write a proper action scene, which is rather the disadvantage, in a novel about World War II. Could potentially have been a better novel, if it had been more focussed; but mostly, it was just lame.


Consuela - Nov 27, 2005 5:49:30 pm PST #9583 of 10002
We are Buffistas. This isn't our first apocalypse. -- Pix

Wow, that's so totally not what I got out of that novel, Nutty.


Nutty - Nov 27, 2005 5:54:28 pm PST #9584 of 10002
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."

Do tell. What did you think of it? (And did you hate War and Remembrance as much as I did?)


Consuela - Nov 27, 2005 6:23:54 pm PST #9585 of 10002
We are Buffistas. This isn't our first apocalypse. -- Pix

I posted a brief review here. [link]

And this is what I ended with: This isn't a novel about the glory of war; neither is it a heartwarming story about how the villagers all pulled together to save the Jews. It's about redemption, and broken people trying to make the right choices. About choosing the right path when there is no right path.

Because I didn't feel the novel was about how bad Hitler was: it was about what people do. What people actually did. Yes, terrible things happened, and yes, the action scenes weren't. But that wasn't the point of it. The point really was about the small grace moments when people reached out to one another, risking their lives and their families, to do the right thing. And about the price they paid for that, and about how even well-meaning people can do terrible things -- like the Allies, like Schramm, like Renzo, like the Jesuits in The Sparrow.

I found it moving and heartbreaking and hopeful while also being ultimately very very sad. I don't know that I'd reread it anytime soon, and Russell's narrative choices aren't the ones that I would make, but I don't think that makes it a bad book.

I've never read any Herman Wouk, and the last Leon Uris I read was many years ago; Trinity, I think. The last WWII novel I recall reading is Edith Pargeter's trilogy, written while the war was going on, which makes it particularly interesting. I should probably go back and find that; she's really really good.


§ ita § - Nov 27, 2005 7:44:21 pm PST #9586 of 10002
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I just finished the first book in Tad Williams's Otherland series. I found it irritatingly dense and vague for the first 2/3, and then when it started to pick up, ended. Which has the effect of making me want to read the next one, stat, so I'm reading Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell since that should give me sufficient time to cool down.

Has anyone read further into the series? I notice there are three more books. Am I setting myself up for more stress?


Katie M - Nov 27, 2005 7:50:46 pm PST #9587 of 10002
I was charmed (albeit somewhat perplexed) by the fannish sensibility of many of the music choices -- it's like the director was trying to vid Canada. --loligo on the Olympic Opening Ceremonies

I read it years ago, ita, and liked it a lot, but it certainly is a big sprawling story. If I remember correctly, you're past a lot of the setup now, so you should get some more forward motion.


Anne W. - Nov 28, 2005 1:47:53 am PST #9588 of 10002
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

I really enjoyed the series, ita. I agree that Williams did play things a little too close to the vest early on, but the revelations come thick and fast from book 2 on.


§ ita § - Nov 28, 2005 4:13:58 am PST #9589 of 10002
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Thanks guys. Does it end after four?