The tough thing is casting Miles. The DH and I have cast and re-cast the Vorkosigan movies (and we're split on Cordelia-Sue, btw...he thinks she is, I think she's borderline but acceptable), and can't find a Miles. Maybe they can CGI Miles a la Gollum.

Yes, and Frodo would like it back.

Wrod.

Manny Sue

SO perfect.

Not a book, but in line with the Idea vs. Story discussion, I watched Amateur last night. Good movie, but I have to admit to missing the Idea because I was waiting for Godot. Or rather, waiting for the main character. I think story should be about a character's (or more than one) challenges, responses, successes, failures, and at the end of the story the character should be changed somehow by what he or she has experienced. At the end of this movie, the protagonist didn't seem to me to have changed at all, while the Idea had been resolved. So I was cranky. If your protagonist, who is ostensibly living the Idea of your story, doesn't have to change to show what the Idea is, I don't think viewers/readers can relate to it. Or at least, can't relate easily.

Now, in the case of "Amateur," it's entirely possible that I mis-identified the protagonist, or that the character changes were just really subtle. So my specific example may be flawed, but I stand by the point that if the Idea resolves without any Story, it's boring. (Conversely, if the Story resolves without any Idea, it's pointless.)

Cordelia looks like Sela Ward in my head. Patrick Bauchau is a great call for Aral. I was thinking someone big and craggy for Aral. Someone like Jonathan Frakes, but with, y'know, character.

Aral is definitely craggy. I don't think he's unusually tall or muscley -- he's more with the presence and will-power. I think Miles gets a bit of that from his da.

Sela Ward's not a bad call for Cordelia. Maybe a bit prettier than I see Cordelia -- I think she comments on how she needs to look for her beauty in Aral's eyes rather than in mirrors.

Miles would be very hard to cast. I could kinda see Danny Strong doing Mark, but I don't know if he could do the hyper-vibrating-off-the-walls that Miles would require.

I could see Rupert Everett as Emperor Gregor, and I'd love to cast Billy Crudup as Byerly (a character in one of the later books). You know, I bet Nicholas Brendon could do a good job as Ivan.

I could see Rupert Everett as Emperor Gregor, and I'd love to cast Billy Crudup as Byerly (a character in one of the later books). You know, I bet Nicholas Brendon could do a good job as Ivan.

Yes yes yes

I keep suggesting Martin Short as Miles, or maybe Mary Lou Retton. Seriously, the physical needs combined with the rather difficult personality make Miles a tough call. And now I'm having total mental lock on any of the actual casting suggestions I'd liked...I knew exactly who needed to be Bothari, and it's gone. Peter Postelwaite, maybe?

I think she comments on how she needs to look for her beauty in Aral's eyes rather than in mirrors.

I put that down to her being, y'know, female.

You know, I bet Nicholas Brendon could do a good job as Ivan.

Good one. I was thinking someone like Jason Lee.

Casting Miles ... damn. I'll have to think about that one.

That's so funny -- I've always seen Ivan as more Phillip Seymour Hoffman in The Talented Mr Ripley -- not exactly like that, but that big blond type. Not sure why.

I haven't met that many of the Miles-era characters yet (I'm on page 50 of "Warrior's Apprentice"), but someone on my LJ suggested Brendan Fraser for Ivan, which strikes me as an excellent fit.

Sela Ward may be a bit too conventionally pretty for Cordelia. Claudia Black would kick all kinds of ass in the role, but I can't imagine her as a red-head at all.

I just don't see Cordelia as a Mary Sue. For one thing, she's clearly not beautiful. There are too many scenes in which someone said, "So that's Aral's Betan," clearly not understanding the attraction. Also, I tend to think of Mary Sues as characters who always do everything right. Most of Cordelia's decisions about Miles can be reasonably seen as either heroic or insane.

When I think of Mary Sues, the two characters who come to mind are both male. There's the hero of Jerry Ahern's Survivalist books, who, in the first book, safely lands the commercial aircraft he's on when the pilot is disabled. I think the ability to land the plane is a clear Mary Sue attribute. There's also E.C. Tubb's Dumarest series, in which, in every book, there's a scene in which Dumarest does something like catch a knife in midair and someone says, "Fast. I've never seen a man so fast." It could be that books like that have set my Mary-Sue Meter pretty high.

Claudia Black is the only actress in the current crop who seems at all Cordelia-like to me. Still, Miles is the real problem. There just aren't that many hyperactive dwarfs who are actors.

There just aren't that many hyperactive dwarfs who are actors.

Or, from another POV, too many actors are too short, so you lose the distinction.

I keep thinking one of the hobbits would do well as Miles, forgetting their perceived shortitude was from forced perspective shots. Both Dom Monaghan and Billy Boyd are apparently around 5'7", making them way too tall for Miles. I'm trying to remember if there is anyone around Danny Strong's height (5'2") who could fit, but coming up entirely blank.

I propose Peter Stormare as Bothari.