Early: You folks are all insane. Simon: Well, my sister's a ship. We had a complicated childhood.

'Objects In Space'


Firefly Spoilers  

Discussion of all Firefly episodes, including "Trash", "The Message", "Heart of Gold", and any movie news.


Fay - Jul 29, 2003 4:13:24 am PDT #319 of 1424
"Fuck Western ideologically-motivated gender identification!" Sulu gasped, and came.

Sympathetic is good, but I rather like the fact that he's a bit of a knob, and with the selfishness and self-interest and Kaylee-threatening, but that it's not black and white. We still sympathise with him, and get a sense of there-but-for-the-grace-of-God to some extent. It's still moving, despite the fact that he has so thoroughly got himself into this mess himself, despite the fact that he isn't a simple victim who made one bad call and then tried to escape. He's kept on making bad decisions. He's been selfish and thoughtless and used people. The way we do.

I don't know - I pretty much do agree with you, but I'm trying to see why they chose to complicate it with this extra layer of treachery. (For I am a devil's advocate. But I don't have an evil hand. Honestly.)

Just struck me - I really liked Kaylee's reaction to the corpse, and the wee scene with her in her engine room listening to the Recording Device Of The Future (tm) - and Simon pausing and then retreating. And I loved the scene with Tracy (?sp?) pulling a gun on Wash, and Zoe shooting him, and the look on his face.


Nutty - Jul 29, 2003 4:28:18 am PDT #320 of 1424
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."

I feel the need, since it has not been mentioned, that Firefly in its brief life has given us more bareass than any other network show short of NYPD Blue. (And nicer bareass, too.) That had to be a funny scene to shoot, with the athletics.

I suppose this is more salient to the, er, naked eye, when one watches Trash and The Message directly in a row, and finds out the tattoo locations of two hot young men within 45 minutes of each other.

(I don't know whether it's actually Holden/Knox -- what is that boy's name -- or the character Tracy who has a tattoo, but I imagine it would be a PITA to go painting tattoos on people what don't already have them. Same again with Captain Tightpants.)


Fay - Jul 29, 2003 4:30:40 am PDT #321 of 1424
"Fuck Western ideologically-motivated gender identification!" Sulu gasped, and came.

I suppose this is more salient to the, er, naked eye, when one watches Trash and The Message directly in a row, and finds out the tattoo locations of two hot young men within 45 minutes of each other.

There was much celebration Chez Jay, I must confess, when the lovely vision of Cap'n NoPants in Trash was so swiftly followed by a scene in which he was himself clad but straddling a cute and naked young chap.

(...and, yes, the tattoos were not unappreciated. Ahem.)

And we have, of course, been treated to a fair number of scenes of Inara getting cosy with men and women - and not being hideously punished for having sex. And also Kaylee being rewarded for having the hot sex in public by getting her dream job.

And let us all pause for a moment to remember the Hot Married Sex.

....

....ahhh, yes. Now that was sexy.


Am-Chau Yarkona - Jul 29, 2003 4:33:39 am PDT #322 of 1424
I bop to Wittgenstein. -- Nutty

I don't know whether it's actually Holden/Knox -- what is that boy's name -- or the character Tracy who has a tattoo, but I imagine it would be a PITA to go painting tattoos on people what don't already have them. Same again with Captain Tightpants.

I'm not sure, but I have a distinct impression that Angel's tattoo is the character's only, and not DB's. With the not-being-visible-in-some-scenes-where-it-should be thing, and if only we had that amount of material (strictly for comparison purposes) for Cap'n Tightpants.


Fay - Jul 29, 2003 4:36:54 am PDT #323 of 1424
"Fuck Western ideologically-motivated gender identification!" Sulu gasped, and came.

Angel's tattoo is the character's only. And indeed I believe that (Joss? Or whomever) was quite taken aback by how huge it was. The tattoo.

Charisma's sexy sun tattoo is, I believe, hidden by makeup (or perhaps is simply didn't exist) in some episodes of Angel, but it's visible in others.

Painting gratuitous tattoos onto pretty naked boyflesh is the sort of job, like shaving Michael Rosenbaum's head, that one would wake up in the morning and weep tears of gratitude to have been given. Or, you know, pay to do, rather than be paid for.


Am-Chau Yarkona - Jul 29, 2003 4:41:40 am PDT #324 of 1424
I bop to Wittgenstein. -- Nutty

Painting gratuitous tattoos onto pretty naked boyflesh is the sort of job, like shaving Michael Rosenbaum's head, that one would wake up in the morning and weep tears of gratitude to have been given. Or, you know, pay to do, rather than be paid for.

If I don't finish reading that sentance because I'm in my bunk, you'll understand, right?


DXMachina - Jul 29, 2003 4:55:26 am PDT #325 of 1424
You always do this. We get tipsy, and you take advantage of my love of the scientific method.

Charisma's sexy sun tattoo is, I believe, hidden by makeup (or perhaps is simply didn't exist) in some episodes of Angel, but it's visible in others.

Yup. Jane Espenson talks about the tattoo a bit in the commentary for "Room with a Vu" because there is one scene where you can see it briefly. In later seasons they just stopped trying to cover it up.


Nutty - Jul 29, 2003 5:03:43 am PDT #326 of 1424
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."

I'm not sure, but I have a distinct impression that Angel's tattoo is the character's only, and not DB's.

Right, but that's a plot point. Or, I don't know, a conversation starter. A symbol of the Vast Angst Of That Strangely Sexy Dude. (Also it helped us know quickly whose bareass we were looking at, when he fell naked at our feet in Buffy S3. Okay, that was mostly Mike Massa, right?)

I have a secret thing for tattoos -- it is probably the equivalent to seeing girls in their underwear. You know that thing, where they're not wearing it for display, only for themselves, so it feels like an intimacy that it actually isn't? Yeah, the guy who plays Vaughn on Alias has a tattoo also, and they showed him shirtless (only once or twice).


DCJensen - Jul 29, 2003 9:41:24 am PDT #327 of 1424
All is well that ends in pizza.

I think Tracy's big problem was that he never thought things through, as evidenced by his war scenes. No plan, just blunder through life,(I empathize with that) but never thinking through what the outcome means.

This is true about selling the organs to the highest bidder. He just assumed he'd deal with the replacemnt organs when the issue came up. And in the "just run" attitude on the planet.

This is also evident in his relationships with Mal and Zoe. Mal was Sarge, world without end. Zoe was Zoe, who would marry her?

It shocked his world that these people had moved on, even if Mal is only starting to. In the end his lack of planning cost him his life.


Fay - Aug 03, 2003 4:59:20 am PDT #328 of 1424
"Fuck Western ideologically-motivated gender identification!" Sulu gasped, and came.

Just re-watched The Message.

God DAMN, I do love this show. Which is becoming something of a tedious refrain by now, I realise, but -- God DAMN, I do love this show.

Adam Baldwin's Jayne -- absobloodylutely priceless. Really. A constant delight. Funny as hell, but more than that too. The whole parcel-opening and letter-reading and delighted reception of the hat -- God, he's adorable. And his glee at the possibility of Tracey's body being full of gold -- man, I did laugh like a drain. But I was also a hair's breadth away from crying several times in this episode -- particularly, on rewatching, because you get to appreciate the full whammy of the irony at the time, with the message itself, and the flashback sequence. River, for all that she has so little to do in this episode, is also wonderfully good -- Summer just inhabits the role beautifully. She's utterly convincing.

I already gushed about the station itself, didn't I? Well, consider me gushing again. It's all so well judged and detailed. Wonderful stuff.

The snow chase scene -- it struck me this time that part of the reason this blew me away is because the effects are excellent, really excellent, but they aren't allowed to showcase themselves. It's a matter of fact inclusion -- had it been a car chase, or a horse chase it would have had the same amount of screen time. What's important is Wash and Mal and co inside the ship, and TraHoldKnox making coweyes at Kaylee. That's class. Moreover, the cinematography (and I guess this isn't the appropriate term for CGI, but I'm buggered if I know what the correct word would be, so we'll leave it at cinematography) is wonderfully naturalistic - the faint wobbliness and the shift of focus lending a near-documentary flavour to the whole spaceship chase sequence, rather than the too-perfect camerawork we're most accustomed to on screen. (In the UK this kind of fauxrealism gave This Life a very distinctive character, and I know I've seen it on US shows before then - this is more delicately managed than that, but it's bloody effective.)

I love Zoe. Did I mention that lately? I love Zoe. But I also love Inara, for entirely different but equally valid reasons. And Book is cool as fuck. And Wash is worthy of Zoe.

And Simon's attempt to show a girl a good time -- too endearing for words.

Plus, nekkid TraHoldKnox! Which was nice. Go Team Nekkid Boyflesh.

(Let it be noted that my failure to sing Mal's praises simply reflects my attempt not to overpraise my husband-to-be in public. Wouldn't want to be accused of favouritism wrt my tightly bepanted Canadian)