I see that you all are just a-splittin' the callowly pretty away from teh hott, while I am a-lumpin' em all together. I agree there is a category of "nice face, pity about there being nothing behind it", and one of "nice face, will look even nicer when it has miles on it" and one of "weird face, in a nummy way" -- but these categories don't map automatically to a simple adjective.

I guess I tend to qualify "pretty" with how that pretty functions -- callow or craggy or vacant or intimidating or fierce or goofy or whatever.

Pretty is a really big tent.

Welling's gorgeous, but most of the time, there's no there there. Which is why Rosenbaum tends to blow him off the screen. And not in the good way.

We seem to be the same person today.

Cool! Does this mean I can hurt someone with my pinkie if I tried today?

I find most young & pretty actors lack charisma/character/je-ne-sais-quoi to tip them over to my 'attractive' threshold, but there are always exceptions. Jude Law fits the bill. Invariably though, when I'm looking at young actors, I tend to find the ones who are not classically pretty more interesting/attractive, although that may be the function of the roles. (The actor who plays Duncan vs. the one who plays Logan--who is a bit rabbitty-looking, objectively-speaking--on Veronica Mars, for example.)

I see that you all are just a-splittin' the callowly pretty away from teh hott

Oh, I'm not. Depp has always been painfully pretty to me, nothing callow about him, and devastatingly hot. My pretty has no value judgment -- Tom Welling is also pretty.

Like Vonnie (go! Kill!) I don't think pretty has to mean attractive. They're intersecting sets, no causal relationship required.

I think there's definitely a class of guy who gets more attractive as he ages. It's like being refined. George Clooney, Timothy Hutton, Andrew McCarthy, RDA, Peter Wingfield, Dennis Quaid, Colin Firth.

Two words: Robert. Redford.

In fact, it's the move *away* from "pretty" to "older/attractive" (whatever word might define that) that trips my GUH-ometer.

Ha. This whole thing make me think there should be Venn diagrams and notations for probability logic in which A = pretty, and B = attractive, and A U B = general term like 'good-looking', and A ∩ ~B (or whatever is the negation sign) = Tom Welling. But I fear I'm not mathy enough.

Wronger than the LFN talent show with the woman who took the stage with her guitar and wouldn't give it back?

Well. You have a point. Of course, when this happened, I believe I had long since fled to the hotel bar for some emergency tequila.

I fear I'm not mathy enough.

Hey! Sounds like a job for natter!

Like Vonnie (go! Kill!) I don't think pretty has to mean attractive.

t sits with Vonnie and ita This despite my disagreement with ita about Shanks' attractiveness in recent years: I'm with Vonnie on wishing he'd pared down instead of beefing up, because it is reflected in his face, and not in a good character-revealing way, more in a I-wish-he'd-eat-more-salads way. He's not unattractive, but he could look better.

But there's pretty, which for me is a purely visual thing: good skin, regular well-proportioned features, maybe something special like Depp's lips. Young Johnny Depp, Orlando Bloom, Tom Welling, Shanks in the first few seasons, Browder on Party of Five and season 1 of FS. Can be bland, but isn't necessarily.

Then there's attractive, which may be a narrower category but covers, for me, a broader range of what is considered physically appealing. And yeah, Dennis Quaid (::fans self::), RDA now (but not as MacGuyver), Robert Redford, Shanks, Browder now. All of it has to do with character as shown by the changes in the face, and with how they move, speak, act. You put Redford in the same room as Welling, and I for one won't pay ANY attention to Welling.

Depp is an odd case, because he's kept the pretty but managed to move into the realm of blisteringly hot in terms of his personal presence.

I fear I'm not mathy enough.

Hey! Sounds like a job for natter!

Browder (base 10) = Welling (base 8).