I think I'm one of the few people who really disliked Tobey as Peter Parker. I was/am too invested in the comic version (and think NB would have been much much better) and found Tobey's tongue-tied, sullen, dim portrayal to be throw-something-at-the-screen unwatchable.

Elena, I think they missed an opportunity for great conflict/drama by hacking out Gwen, but I guess it was the usual narrow movie focus.

JSw, I hated him too. I don't think he's a good actor, even if I could get past the voice. But I don't think I tap into the Spidey things that make his fanbase tick.

And Tobey Maguire won me over; don't get me wrong. But who does dorky-yet-heroic-and-also-quippy better than NB?

Nobody. I don't care if they had to retcon the age. It's not like film always respects the literature from which it springs.

sprains brain figuring out billytea's joke

I blame that on Tobey's apparent lack of wit (based on the interviews I've seen of him where he comes across as quite unintelligent).

It has been my experience that there are two types of actors - the not so bright ones, who aren't necessarily unintelligent, but very much blank slates for the director to mold as they will, and the hyperintelligent ones.

It's been my experience that actors tend to pretty evenly span the continuum of brains.

I'm guessing they were looking to enhance the contrast of the wise-cracking webslinger by making Tobey/Peter to be more withdrawn and shy (and also: mask on, insecurities off), but that's not the Peter Parker I grew up with, and that's from before the actual comics that the movie story was based on.

ita? What Spidey things do the Tobey fanbase say re: ticking?

For me, killing Gwen was like the killing of Jenny Calendar was for some people with Buffy. An HSQ moment that let you know these people were seriously prepared to mess you up (even considering the totally crass cover of #121). That's why I think conflating Gwen and Mary Jane was a mistake for the movie. It robbed it of serious drama/tension.

Still, fun flick and all, Willem Dafoe great, but I didn't enjoy it as much as I could have.

I think I'm one of the few people who really disliked Tobey as Peter Parker.

so, it's ita, JohnSweden and me, over here in the corner hating Tobey McGuire. Shall I get us a round?

Sorry -- I didn't mean the Tobey fanbase, but the Spidey fanbase. Admittedly, he's not one of my favourites, but it wasn't until pre-movie discussion that I realised that Spiderman was the geek made powerful (in contrast to Superman, the noble hero by birth, and Bats, the dark hero by accident and then design).

In fact, I see those three heroes as a nice little way of dividing most personalities.

Although -- I'm a Wolvie/Storm fan.

I'm guessing they were looking to enhance the contrast of the wise-cracking webslinger by making Tobey/Peter to be more withdrawn and shy

My point was that Spidey, in the movie, wasn't wise-cracking or funny or witty or, well, SPIDEY.

That's why I think conflating Gwen and Mary Jane was a mistake for the movie. It robbed it of serious drama/tension.

It cheapened what the comic had done. It was - along with Uncle Ben's death - the defining moment for Peter. It's one thing for them to ignore it, they changed it and happied it up and fucking invalidated Gwen's life. And I know that Gwen is a comic book character and therefore doesn't have a life to be invalidated but rationality doesn't come into play on this one.

Darned misclick ate my lengthy post and I have to go eat. More later.