Rafmun, I would caution you, in the strongest terms possible, to avoid doing things if you don't like it when others do them.
This, for example:
You know what? You can't convey tone by an overt statement indicating that is the tone in
which your words should be understood.
Heh heh - I actually like this!
You can't explain what you mean by explaining what you meant!
And of course, the content of the words have already been dismissed, as have the specific points raised.
I would ask you to do what you would have others do -- take a deep breath and think about the fact that there are other human beings on the other end of the line. The "I don't mean to be aggressive, but I think you're an asshole," is a pretty good counter-example to 'tone can be expressed explicitly without reference to content'; explicit markers are good, but word choice in the actual content counts more. Most people here haven't posted with you except in this thread; we don't -know- what your usual 'tone' is. Please don't go out of your way to twist the words of someone who is trying to understand you -- it makes you no friends and it weakens your other arguments by making people (e.g. me) consider the notion that you may be prolonging the conflict for the conflict's sake, or that you have agendas that we don't know about, which would, again, speaking for me, be a real bummer. If what you really want is for peple to be more civil and to avoid 'running over each other' in text, then I'm afraid that the only way to lead is by example.
Rather than asserting that "You can't convey tone by an overt statement indicating your tone" is equivalent to "You can't explain what you mean by explaining what you meant," perhaps you might find ways to meet your fellow posters half-way.
I am also a bit surprised to find you holding on to the notion of being 'dismissed' after nearly four hundred posts. You might argue that people are not 'listening' as closely as you wish they would, or are not being as self-critical as you might wish, or are taking the wrong meanings from what you've posted, but I hardly think a debate of this size constitutes being 'dismissed.' Being marginalised is another issue.
Edited to add: And of course, after I've gotten all wound up, I find that he's gone to bed in the interim. That'll teach me to be long-winded after I've promised myself I'd stay out of the discussion.
Does a moral bankruptcy stay on your record for 7 years?
It's just that Hickok on Deadwood is kind of a morally bankrupt drifter/parasite who coasts on his reputation and people being scared shitless of him.
Oh, good. Yeah, that sounds about right.
Look, I can be just as morally bankrupt as the next person. Stop trying to limit my potential.
Sorry about that, eh? Or are you just assuming from my implication that I consider moral bankruptcy to be a negative character trait?
Now I'm the one feeling hedged in.
Now I'm the one feeling hedged in.
t buys protective put on JohnSweden
Upthread now, but beautiful post, Matt.
And Nutty...where were you all day! Couldn't you feel the incipient shit flinging about to happen at the monkey house? Your apeish brethren needed you. Anyway, I'm very glad you arrived to excavate the thread with your mighty shovel of clarity.
Elena, of course tone can be misinterpreted and it is wise to check first before you jump on somebody. Which...I think is what tends to happen around here. Or if people get pissed off, they hop on AIM and vent, but they don't kerfuffle all that much in-thread. Sometimes, of course, and a little more often lately.
Also, I wish that you had worked through to a better compromise on the deathmatch notices, because in part - you were in some ways the representative of the Death Match peeps. And I think it didn't have to be an either/or decision, and that merely cutting the volume would've been a satisfactory compromise. I did appreciate your gesture to simply stopping posting in Press, but in retrospect it feels less like something that was generously given, but resentfully given up. I don't think it had to come to that.
You know, I've been going over some of my guacs of old in a minor fit of self-indulgence (good times), and you could smell the moral indignation a mile away. So I can certainly see how Rafmun feels at this moment. At some point someone, I think it was Deena, told me to start hanging around a bit more in other threads, talk more about myself, my life, my family etc. and just get to know people outside the Bureaucrazy thread.
Rafmun, I pass the same on to you. Play with us in Natter. Curse network execs with us in Angel, Firefly and Minearverse. Share TMI with us in Bitches. Overanalyze movies, music, tv and books with us. Send and receive ma for no reason at all. Enjoy us and let us enjoy you.
As often as this thread is the solution, it can also be the problem.
David, I don't want to get into that again.
Aw, Wolfram. Go you with the Buffista-ness.
(This was an exceedingly long thread to get through, for a day of posts.)
