Equal treatment. That's what it's always been about. Allyson's contributions are numerous and valuable and Zoe is a semi-coherent newbie babbler. But if either one violates CS, warn 'em.Equal treatment.

But the issues I have with Allyson and Zoe aren't equal, and I suspect that's true for most people. There's no pattern of offensiveness with Allyson, and there is with Zoe. To put it another way, I wish Allyson hadn't posted some of the things she did today, especially the subhuman comment. I wish Zoe didn't post here, period.

Also, Allyson is here, addressing the issues people have with her. She may not respond the way you want her to, but she is here, responding. Zoe is not, and seems stubborn in ignoring all of our efforts to get her here. I think that says a lot.

I'm tired of having to defend myself for having asked that she be warned.

Kat, who ever said you shouldn't have done so? You thought she should be warned. A lot of people thought she should be warned. I thought she shouldn't. A few people thought she shouldn't. What is wrong with reasonable people debating a point? Why is it an attack?

Or possibly, what the bitterone said.

And dammit, I crossed my own line, I posted in bureaucracy.

There's no hope for me now, is there? :)

You know, Allyson actually realises there is a community here. Until Zoe cops to understanding that the electrons on the other side of the screen come from somewhere other than her imagination, I cannot even REMOTELY see how the two cases are equivalent.

Dude, Allyson was cruel. I'm not arguing about that. But it *is* retroactive, because a months ago offence is what you can't extract an apology for.

Shall we go back through all the files? Shall I find where Kat may have pissed me off with spoilage and get her to apologise for that, or to lie, or to risk being warned?

Zoe has shown a committed and repeated disregard for just about everyone here, and certainly for the synergy. You may despise what Allyson did, but she ..

No, I don't have the words. Eloquent people here will say it better.

Trudy, I know you apologized, but when the word Orwellian was brought up... that's when it became an attack.

No offense meant to Allyson, Steph, bitterchick, Plei or anyone else in that corner..

And yet I am offended. Offense meant or not. Still offended.

I know we try to avoid using "old-timers" and "newbies." But frankly, it pisses me off when people who are new come in and try to change our policy.

Well I'm glad we got that equal treatment crap out in the open. I'll be more careful in the future. And I withdraw my request to warn Allyson.

Because it feels to me like you've been pushing and pushing to mold this board into something it never was, and you've been stomping on the feelings of long-term posters left and right for the sakes of a handful of asswads.

I'm sorry. I'll stop the pushing. And the stomping. It was not intentional. Once again, I withdraw my request.

And Kat, I didn't mean to offend you either. Your complaints are legitimate and you don't need to defend them to me.

I'm really going to bed.

Shall I find where Kat may have pissed me off with spoilage and get her to apologise for that, or to lie, or to risk being warned?

I apologize. Though I didn't piss you off with spoilage. But I pissed you off about spoilage.

And I'm wrong. I now admit it. I see the light. Though watching Angel spoiled makes it less eye-pokingly painful. Oh wait. If we're doing retroactive stuff, Plei can have me warned for not being nice about disagreeing about Angel and for nitpicking.

Though I didn't piss you off with spoilage. But I pissed you off about spoilage.

Well, it was a stab in the dark. I don't even remember it, not one bit.

But the being right thing I can work with.

What Kat and Plei and Steph said, Wolfram. I'll be blunt. I frequently take issue with your stances in this thread because you seem to operate under the belief that nothing that happened on this board before you showed up is relevant. And I find it completely offensive to those people who have been here for years, myself included.

In other news, I want a retroactive apology from everyone who mocked NSYNC's Bee Gees Grammy tribute.

To put it another way, I wish Allyson hadn't posted some of the things she did today, especially the subhuman comment. I wish Zoe didn't post here, period.

What Perkins said. To me, 'subhuman' is as offensive as a racial, religious, or orientation-related slur. If I'm alone in that, let me know, and I'll back down and try to reset my PC-o-meter.