I do go to Spoilers, at least over the summer and about halfway through the year, since my personal definition of being spoiled only includes knowing what's in the last chapter/page, as it were. But (whitefonted for a reference to the (single) BCS) the general zeitgeist about the BCS there is such that I really feel like I'd be unwelcome talking about how excited I am to have Spike on the show, and to speculate on what his role may be. My impression is that the more general Angel thread would have a different vibe. Maybe I'm just being oversensitive and need to get over it, and if I just had the nerve to open my mouth, there would be others with similar views interested in discussing it. I just don't know.

Steph, I don't want to know earlier than necessary because I don't want to know ANYTHING earlier than necessary.

And, even though Joss has said nothing about how it happens, that doesn't stop him from yet doing so. I fear knowing more than I already do.

I feel like there must be a point you are trying to make or a purpose this serves, but I can't see it.

Absolutely. The reason it was tossed at me was because I asked -- how will one know if one's information is news or a spoiler?

I think that's very important, and that's why I did stuff like as Plei if she'd be willing to vet info.

I don't want a rule where it's too easy for well-meaning people to come into Angel and start talking about a cast change among regulars that hasn't been announced by the WB.

That's all this line of enquiry has every been about -- the existing def is very verifiable. I'd like any replacement to be as nice and tight and neat.

Steph, I don't want to know earlier than necessary because I don't want to know ANYTHING earlier than necessary.

Why are you basing "necessary" on the WB's random date of running the promo? You'll still know about the character before 9:01 October 8.

Again, serious question.

Trudy, FWIW, I'd want to be able to discuss any and all main cast changes, because IMO they don't happen in a vacuum--I'd want to speculate about how any new characters would fit in with existing characters, and how the absence of any characters who might be leaving would impact the relationships of all the remaining ones, new and returning.

Susan is me. I guess I am a 1ish 2ish person. I really thought that we used to discuss such things.

Waiting for the network to promote might be a long wait. It appears they have forgotten they have Angel in their lineup. I watched some god awful movie on that network the other day while I was reading just to watch promos and I saw lots and lots of promos. None for Angel.

I find it rather depressing.

even though Joss has said nothing about how it happens, that doesn't stop him from yet doing so.

So? It would still be a spoiler if he did -- the proposal is about "who" not "how" or "why".

But it DID hinder discussion. It absolutely did. There was a 2-week moratorium (or 1-week?) which meant we couldn't discuss Faith being on AtS, even though the entire Buffy arc was about the Slayer line. So we couldn't even say -- in a discussion about the Slayer line -- "Hey, since Faith is in LA, and we saw Angelus call Sunnydale, do you think she'll come to Sunnydale?"

I'm sorry that it did. But your example would have very specifically - plot point specifically - spoiled me, and any other Atlantic Canadian who was unspoiled, for that episode of AtS. So your conversation would have been hindered. Mine would have been stopped, because I would not have been able to participate in the thread.

Yes, I could continue to post in Atlantic Canadians, and did so. But there are, what?, 5 regular posters in that thread, and the occassional wildfeed viewer, so that would have made for a very limited conversation. Much more limited than what is currently enjoyed in Spoilers.

I'll hasten to add that the whitefont was not done at my request, but I did benefit from it, and was very greatful for it.

Steph, I don't want to know earlier than necessary because I don't want to know ANYTHING earlier than necessary.

Okay. And part of your argument is that you'd have nowhere to discuss the show. I'd propose the "Spoiler Virgins: Speculation Leads to Genital Warts and Hellfire" thread. That was supposed to be funny. The title, not the suggestion.

'Cause, I'm fairly certain, that if the shield of Grandpappy doesn't cover you, the Casting Info/Upfronts update to the FAQ would pass. And i wouldn't want you without a showthread.

Why are you basing "necessary" on the WB's random date of running the promo? You'll still know about the character before 9:01 October 8.

Because it is a long standing standard I have learned to live with. It is also clearly enforcable.

So? It would still be a spoiler if he did -- the proposal is about "who" not "how" or "why".

If Joss said he's human that would somehow stay out of the discussions?

The spoiler policy was changed to reflect the Cross-Show Whitefont Rule. And that should not have happened under the grandfather rule.

Which it didn't - the grandfather rule was only voted on in May.

I'm not going to harp on the grandfather thing right now - we're all operating on memory for how any of this stuff came about, for one thing. And the divide between the various conceptions of the policy - There is a concrete written policy. What some people are arguing (and this wasn't entirely clear to me in the beginning) is that there is another, phantom policy. In their view, it's the phantom policy that needs changing, not the concrete one. How or whether the grandfather thing might apply is something we're pretty far from answering, and I think we're making progress on other issues. So personally, I'ma let it go for now.