Elena, those terms aren't mutually exclusive. And, yes, I'm being snarky, cause a lot of people feel the current spoiler policy was "not a valid decision" the way it came about. Hence, the vote.

And, yes, I'm being snarky, cause a lot of people feel the current spoiler policy was "not a valid decision" the way it came about. Hence, the vote.

Ken, you brought up the fact that the rule was one of our old "bullshit consensus" decisions. That reminded me of the fact that we had a discussion and vote just two months ago on this very issue - many people felt strongly that we did not want decisions made under the old ways to be suddenly declared "not valid decisions." The decision not to reopen this stuff for the time being was voted on - not bs consensus, not midnight fiat, not invalid in any way. I don't see how this discussion wouldn't fall under that. Can you explain to me why it a) was not a valid decision and b) shouldn't fall under the grandfathering we just voted in?

Brenda's point is sound -- this is grandfathered bullshit, isn't it?

No, I don't think so. It wasn't ever discussed or talked about, and we have already amended the thing that happened with Cross Show discussion, so there's that p. word again.

Wasn't ever discussed or talked about? Who wrote it then? Why is in the FAQ?

Do we have any access to our archives somewhere? I can't get in to WX, as usual.

It wasn't ever discussed or talked about

Who made the decision?

It wasn't ever discussed or talked about, and we have already amended the thing that happened with Cross Show discussion, so there's that p. word again.

Plei, p. word? I don't know what that would be.

Oh fuckity - did I just make it so the Supremes get to decide this vote?

Can you explain to me why it a) was not a valid decision and b) shouldn't fall under the grandfathering we just voted in?

See above. There was NEVER discussion about it through what were, at the time, the proper channels. Hec's simile about pot laws comes closest too it.

I think that where part of the problem, and part of this misunderstanding comes in about the anger, is that the response here has been from the unspoiled "take it to the spoiler threads", without any real knowledge of what the spoiler thread culture is like, or how that would affect discussion.

Hmm. I'm not making much sense, and I know that.

But, here goes, I'll try.

You are essentially saying "don't ask, don't tell", because as much as I love the discussion in the spoiler thread, it's not really the same as an open discussion about what might happen with, for example, a non-regular Giles (and now I want to make Exlax jokes). It's much more limited, and tends to die out faster. Ghettoized discussion has serious drawbacks.

As a side note, posts made in the Spoiler thread are being judged like they have the same tone as the rest of the board. They don't. It's a subculture, with a language all its own. If you don't know it or speak it, it might seem harsh. It's just... different. Please also take that into consideration.

Okay, I'll try to recap the arguments as I have heard them WRT the shift in the spoiler policy. FTR, these are not necessarily my views. There is a perceived shift towards more spoiler-phobic. I am not arguing that this is necessarily the case, but that it is being perceived as such. Here are some of the reasons for that perception:

Shift that is not spelled out in what Trudy cited: For most of the entire season, we could not discuss the one show on the other thread. That was not the case in previous seasons, I don't think. Some objected, others seemed to not be bothered by it. Others, who were on tape delay for one show but not the other, were grateful.

Shift for between seasons: ALL info WRT Angel S5 is being considered spoilery, and hence there is no speculation going on in that thread at all about next season. I am not convinced that the big elephant is different in *kind* than the news that Buffy was going to return in S6, but it certainly is being treated differently in the threads.

Points where I think there is major agreement: I don't think that anyone wants to change the basic definition of a spoiler. There is no proposed change whatsoever to plot spoilers. None to in-season spoilers either.

Plei, can you please answer my question in this post

Elena "Voting Discussion: We're Screwing In Light Bulbs AIFG!" Jul 25, 2003 9:57:26 pm PDT

Because I can't make sense of what you mean without knowing the answer.