Also in the ugly tired group.

Me three, though that may have to do with Tuesday being a travel day to Denver, less than 21 hours in CO, and a flight home that didn't get me to my house until midnight yesterday.

Happy birthday, Trudy!

I was really tired yesterday. So I took a 90 minute nap after work and then went to bed early. So I got about 10.5 hours of sleep in total. I'm still tired but less than yesterday.

Hippo birdies, Trudy!

I am going to have to state outright that the following thoughts are not "ethical", ie, concerned with the welfare of animals, or mindful of suffering in the world, etc.

A Ravelry board is intensely debating how you can determine if your silk is ethically sourced. Also, is it better if the egg is unfertilized, if the pupa is killed, if it's the larva, or if the adult is killed to prevent the world being overtaken by silk moths. Also, isn't the whole thing animal enslavement (OK, they didn't talk about that, but I bailed on the conversation so it may have come up)? Maybe it's OK if the larva died naturally (though someone pointed out that silk farmers can't take a larva's pulse)?

I know this is a matter of deep concern to many people, but i can't help staring at this conversation in disbelief.

This does not include the difficulties in finding out if the sheep you get your wool from were "ethically" sheared.

I'm just going to have to claim my less-than-advanced state and remember that sheep that are badly treated are not profitable sheep and that a lot of these species/variants wouldn't even exist if it weren't for farmers.

I have to admit I've given little thought to the suffering of the silkworms who created the material for my scarf. I suspect I lack advanced Buddha nature.

A closer reading of the thread revealed several people marking Disagree on the woman who began the thread and her worries about doing the right thing by the silkworms. And someone else said she wasn't worried about the fate of bugs, and she's a vegetarian.

Makes me wonder if the Buddhist monks only wear cotton they picked and spun themselves.

There was a side debate on the ethics of shipping things and whether shipping on a boat from Australia was better than trucking things in from Spain (initial poster is in England). Shipping was ruled more ecofriendly.

Happy birthday, Trudy!

I suspect I lack advanced Buddha nature.

Every now and then, very well-meaning vegan people try to tell me that eating honey oppresses bees. I remove myself from those conversations very quickly.

My apologies to everyone who woke up ugly tired, because I think I stole all the sleep.

I do have ethical issues with honey, but they are pretty much the same as I do for mass agri-business in general. I take it a little more personally when hives are mistreated because I do particularly like bees. But if you know the source of your honey you can find out what kind of practices they follow (and verify that your honey is really honey and not a smidgen of honey in a lot of corn syrup).

Silkworms just make me think of how it at least used to be common practice for the women harvesting the silk to steam and eat the silkworms as they went. Efficient!