Oh, I totally agree, javachik (and I love Ellen!!). But at the same time, having people in the community say "NO, you shouldn't have men in Speedos dancing on floats at Pride, we can't give the wrong impression to the media and straight people! It should be all about couples and their children and how we're JUST LIKE YOU!" pisses me off.

Just a quick aside: javachik, my brother lives in (or at least near) Kerrville! Small world.

Eta: meara, that's something I have been thinking about lately, how having a little bit of grudging acceptance can make for more pressure to conform to broad societal norms than being very marginalized. Not that I am for marginalization, but it's a weird side effect of progress.

Oh, I totally agree, javachik (and I love Ellen!!). But at the same time, having people in the community say "NO, you shouldn't have men in Speedos dancing on floats at Pride, we can't give the wrong impression to the media and straight people! It should be all about couples and their children and how we're JUST LIKE YOU!" pisses me off.

Oh yeah, I can see that. It's why I started out with "in the end, if what you want..." and I think there might be some in your community who don't give a crap about outside acceptance? Or they do but they don't want to change to be accepted? In any case, I was just so pleased that politics never came up and that we actually had a good talk about teh gayz AND the importance of not supporting companies who mostly outsource/don't treat employees well/etc. It was such a wonderful vacation.

-t, cool! Where does he live? Do you ever visit him there?

It was such a wonderful vacation.

Oh, that's great to hear. I'm glad you had a good time.

How's the consulting going? Getting enough hours?

'suela, YES. I have to turn down work, actually. It's going exceedingly well. Thanks for asking (and I hope to see you in person soon!).

I haven't been yet, java. He's only been out there sort of temporarily a year and is in the process of moving permanently right now. He's on a ranch outside of Kerrville, his in-laws' place - I think their mailing address is Kerrville but they aren't in town.

Heh. He could be neighbors with my cousin! B lives outside of Kerrville, too.

I think there might be some in your community who don't give a crap about outside acceptance? Or they do but they don't want to change to be accepted?

Exactly. Some people are very "screw them all" (like some young radical queers I know who are like "marriage is the patriarchy! we dont' need it!") and some are like "Hey, I want acceptance and marriage and all that, but where the hell has that been the last 30 years as I dealt with AIDS and my family and church disowning me? Nowhere. But my leather/bear/drag family has been there for me, and I shouldn't have to disavow that just to get acceptance" which is so valid...but it's true that it's the Ellens and the nice couple down the street who are changing hearts. So tough.

Those are really good illustrations and I totally understand.

Speaking of gay rights (or the lack thereof), Moscow has apparently banned Pride for the next century. And no, that's not The Onion.