...because God knows you need some satisfaction in life besides shagging Captain Cardboard! And I never really liked you anyway. And you have stupid hair!

Spike ,'Selfless'


Natter 69: Practically names itself.  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, duct tape, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


Zenkitty - Apr 07, 2012 9:11:10 am PDT #29913 of 30001
Every now and then, I think I might actually be a little odd.

Erin, that is a great story. You rock, and it's great how your dad was able to change his mind.

I thought about telling some stories about my family and racism, but I think I won't. My mom, bless her, was able to accept all black people as children of God, but she couldn't accept a black man as her daughter's boyfriend. Turns out, it still kinda hurts.


smonster - Apr 07, 2012 9:21:13 am PDT #29914 of 30001
We won’t stop until everyone is gay.

Erin, you and your family rock.

ita !, yes, she's left-handed. She does have a tutorial on doing transfers, but she paints directly on her right hand.

Ah, Zen. I'm sorry for the pain, both physical and emotional.


§ ita § - Apr 07, 2012 9:24:00 am PDT #29915 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

When my sister was about 16, my mother was homophobic enough that my sister threatened to have an affair with a woman to test her, since she usually caved on anything when it came to someone she loved, in her real life.

However, my sister didn't need to, because my family is a walking talking operation-having test in queerdom, predominantly on my mother's side. My mother is 25 years later, over her homophobia enough to be calling into radio shows and yelling at people about condemning gay people (and getting teased about it (in a friendly way) by co-workers). She does admit to having a reflexive discomfort around transsexuals that's sufficient that she's worried she'll upset our FTM cousin, and she doesn't want to. She just thinks she'll say the wrong things, and she's not sure if she can learn to say "him" where she would have said "her".

She has an extensive clinical understanding of many of these issues, but it's really different when it's your sister, your nieces, your nephews, your cousins, and she's trying to default to inclusive language, and she's just not sure she can.

I feel for her, but I also feel that fuck it, just throw yourself out there and learn. It's not like you can practice at home in your bedroom and get good at it. Look at your niece-now-nephew and see how much of a he he is, and it will be so much easier. You're imagining a much more femme version in your head and thinking you can't apply masculine terms to that. It's a lot easier than you think.

Also, his sister hasn't mastered it, so...really...you'll get a pass if you try where he can see you.


Lee - Apr 07, 2012 9:35:20 am PDT #29916 of 30001
The feeling you get when your brain finally lets your heart get in its pants.

Nail polish fans!

Speaking of which, are you in or out for the next round of the polish exchange?

My mother has either gotten more racist with age or just less good at hiding it. It's not really a black white thing though. About 10 years ago, when they were selling their house, my mother inexplicably started in on how she didn't really want to sell to Armenians, or at least not those kind of Armenians.


Strix - Apr 07, 2012 9:35:46 am PDT #29917 of 30001
A dress should be tight enough to show you're a woman but loose enough to flee from zombies. — Ginger

It was a long process, but the thing about my dad -- he always LISTENED.

He didn't change overnight. It took 20 years or so. And he's still not perfect, but he's trying.


smonster - Apr 07, 2012 9:43:07 am PDT #29918 of 30001
We won’t stop until everyone is gay.

Speaking of which, are you in or out for the next round of the polish exchange?

I was waffling, but I'm in. Do you have my new address?


§ ita § - Apr 07, 2012 9:43:53 am PDT #29919 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I have a fair amount of racists, or, well shadists or ethnocentrists in my extended family. Not so much with the immediate. There's no chance of me changing it, because they're entirely self-aware, and it's a conscious decision they're perfectly happy with. I mean, when someone says "I hate the Nigerians. They're the only black people that sincerely believe they're better than Jamaicans." what the hell can I do?

I do try and point out the hypocrisy and possible irony at every turn, but get told to fuck off in response pretty much all the time.

Ah, well, so be it.

What we had thought was sexism on my father's part turned out to be a demonstration of him believing he was better than everyone. He wasn't better than women because he was a man, just because he was him. He's also better than all men minus one.

Oh, okay. It's pretty hard to argue someone out of that point of view.


Lee - Apr 07, 2012 9:59:46 am PDT #29920 of 30001
The feeling you get when your brain finally lets your heart get in its pants.

Do you have my new address?

Nope! That was going to be my next question.

You know what's a really good way to feel like a failure as a home owner? Trying to turn back on the sprinklers and failing because you can't get the #%*^ box that houses the controls open. I even went out there with tools and took it off the wall of the house, and it's still stuck shut.


flea - Apr 07, 2012 10:05:21 am PDT #29921 of 30001
information libertarian

The day we moved into our house, we locked ourselves out in the first 15 minutes. mr. flea had to jimmy open a back window and climb in. Then we lost the cat. Shit happens.

My family does ok on race (well, except Great-grandpa, but he's a) 90 and b) an asshole anyway.) Class, on the other hand, is our downfall. I am sure my mother would have been chuffed if I'd married the young Barack Obama, but she was a bit suspicious about my (then) boyfriend who was a graduate student in engineering and had merely middle-middle class accountants for parents.


Theodosia - Apr 07, 2012 10:11:25 am PDT #29922 of 30001
'we all walk this earth feeling we are frauds. The trick is to be grateful and hope the caper doesn't end any time soon"

I saw this article and thought of Hecubus: [link] At least he hasn't taken it to this extreme... yet.