Ha, smonster, funny we should meet HERE to talk about THIS.

Poetic, in a way. Too bad coffee makes me jittery and fear paralyzes me. My gods are... mindfulness and water. Or something.

I'm convinced that part of the issue with the community center in NYC is people that have never been to NYC trying to asses how the city works. Manhattan isn't geographically large. A few blocks away in Manhattan might as well be a different world. It could certainly be a different neighborhood. In LA it would be like someone being offended about something in Pasadena being right next to Watts.

ND, I think that also plays into the "why don't you have it somewhere else?" thing. NY is a city of neighborhoods, right? Where people walk and take the subway everywhere. Move it across town and they could lose their congregation.

Matt, I agree with all of this, for the record. I don't think feelings should be given primacy over Constitutional principles. And I think it will be an American triumph when the community center is built.

I absolutely support the Cordoba Initiative's right to build the center (and, not that it matters, but I should note it does not cause me pain, unease, or offense). I wish, last night, that I'd thought to express my feelings thusly, "Were my congregation in the Cordoba Initiative's position, I would suggest that we change our plans, in order to avoid causing pain and strife."

As a very lapsed, very former New-England-Protestant-gone-native, I share the cultural referents you alluded to, and understand your general position.

That said, I respectfully disagree. Such decisions enact a sort of prior restraint which can only be explained by "I'm afraid of the conflict or social disruptions that this will cause."

While I understand the desire to not make waves, excessive deference to the dominant culture has (I think) a greater deleterious effect than open conflict. Such deference reinforces the idea that a given non-dominant-culture group must defer to the dominant culture even when the dominant culture's values and sentiment diverges from the law....and that is a very bad idea.

Well, huh: [link]

After weeks of heated debate over plans for an Islamic community center near Ground Zero - the site of the 9/11 attacks on New York - it seems Muslim leaders will soon back down, agreeing to move to a new site.

Sources in New York said on Monday that Muslim religious and business leaders will announce plans to abandon the project in the next few days.

New York Governor David Patterson said last weekend that Muslim leaders had rejected outright his proposal tto swap the site in for another in Manhattan.

But several people familiar with the debate among New York's Islamic activists now claim that the leaders are convinced abandoning the site is preferable to unleashing a wave of bitterness towards Muslims.

They also hope the move will be seen as a show of sensitivity to families of the victims of the 9/11 attacks, and to the American public generally.

Another factor in the apparent climbdown is a lack of funds to pay for construction of the center, estimated to cost a hundred million dollars. Backers hope moving it will lead to a wave of support, accompanied by cash donations.

Dag.

I didn't immediately see any other sources for that, so it may be just rumor. (And that blog post is from yesterday, so for all I know it's already been debunked.)

Fuck. The "Christian" terrorists have won this one. striking until it's confirmed

While I understand the desire to not make waves, excessive deference to the dominant culture has (I think) a greater deleterious effect than open conflict. Such deference reinforces the idea that a given non-dominant-culture group must defer to the dominant culture even when the dominant culture's values and sentiment diverges from the law....and that is a very bad idea.

Damn, Matt, I love your spicy brains. Keith O pointed out that they have more to fear from us, than us from them. There's this recurring theme where when a certain segment of the US white Christian population* encounters anything out of their experience, they experience it as having that thing "shoved in their face." I don't they are self-aware enough to realize that racial, cultural, religious, and sexual minorities have the dominant culture shoved in their face every damn day, and they are (in some cases literally) dying for safe spaces and a little leeway to express themselves and be who they are.

I know that I both chose to live in other countries and am extraordinarily priviliged to have been able to do so, but I wish every American could have that experience, be able to see their country and culture from the outside, let go of the poison of American essentialism and xenophobia.

* Please note my care in not tarring all whites and/or all Christians with the same brush, and I am certainly not referring to Buffistas here.

bt, peace and strength wishes for all the loved ones. Such sad news.

On the link above, huh. Sure haven't heard anything about that on the broadcast news.

I haven't read that anywhere else, though. If it is true, that would be handing them a win, though. Yes. ETA: Bloggers aren't on it, either, Laura.