Major belated meara-ish mash-up thing here in response to the responses to this; let's see how many servings of breakfast food it takes to do this...

First, my thanks for the warm and welcoming comments from so many Buffistas, you know who you are. You confirmed my feeling that this is a community where people matter, regardless of how impassioned the debate may get. I especially appreciated the salad shooter diversion. That was pure 'Fista right there.

Those of you who feel your blood pressure rise when politics come up are advised to skip on or hit "block" now. Or skip to the end, when I finish saying things about politics and come back to something that you might agree with.

Here are some icebergs - you'll see the tops, but there is considerably more matter for continued conversation underneath, if you like.

--- Politics begins here ---

Miranda rights: I stand corrected on whether they apply to non-Americans. I will ask those who know more about these things if Miranda rights apply to enemy combatants. The Christmas bomber was not a shoplifter. He was an agent of a non-state enemy of this country, wearing no uniform, and actively attempting to kill American civilians. Whether caught on U.S. soil or otherwise, I think that (should) effectively take him out of standing for Miranda rights, but I'm not a lawyer.

I am, however, extremely hardcore about people who try to kill me and my family. Especially when their reason for doing so is to bring about a worldwide theocracy most notable for its anti-non-Muslim, anti-democratic, anti-women, anti-gay agenda. And please don't tell me about how awful it is to have your rights taken away. Understood. But that's not what I'm talking about. If you commit crimes, or conspire to commit crimes, you lose some rights.

Enhanced interrogation: I don't think that even something as extreme as waterboarding, under specific guidelines that limit the duration, number, and extent of the procedure, against a known terrorist whose information could save lives, should NEVER be used. And there were guidelines to how it was used, and there were real plots revealed and stopped (KSM gave up a lot after getting wet), and there were exaggerations in the press, and there were hyper-ventilating anti-Bush screeds that turned the debate into shouting matches that accomplished nothing. I will not get into one of those here.

I will just repeat that I firmly believe that when a group of people is determined on your destruction, you kill them first. And if making some of them uncomfortable (show me where the sleep dep, etc. used by U.S. forces was done without medical supervision, or resulted in long-term harm), or threatening, and frightening them, keeps my family alive, I'm just fine with that. The people Saddam Hussein's sons got their hands on, THEY were tortured. Likewise the people who fell afoul of the monsters running North Korea, Cuba, Iran, the Soviet Union, and their ilk going back in history. (And those were innocent victims, not wannabe killers.) When we talk about enhanced interrogation as practiced under the government's guidelines, the things those monsters did are NOT what we're talking about. Keith Olbermann or Jon Stewart may have told you they are, but they aren't. I have a feeling this is one of the things I'll just have to agree to disagree about with a lot of people here.

I am NOT excusing the people who abused prisoners in Abu Ghraib. They were wrong, acted outside the guidelines, and deserved more punishment than they got.

I am saying that "can't we all just get along" really doesn't work in some circumstances, and I expect my government to do a lot more than talk to keep me safe.

Republicans/conservatives/Tea Party/et al: I am (continued...)

Raisin bran. ( continues...) a Republican because it fits most closely with my beliefs, but there's definitely a Venn diagram sort of thing going on there. I'm a little libertarian (but not Rand-ist), conservative in other ways. I'm for fiscal responsibility, the free market with a safety net for those in real need, gun rights (although I don't own one), and mostly, most strongly, I'm foreign policy/defense hawk. I don't want to live in a world run by Evangelical Christianity, or Islam, or Judaism, for that matter. I want people to act like grownups (or try to) and have the freedom and opportunity to run their own lives as much as possible.

I think the tea parties have been mostly attended by regular people who are mad and are using time-honored American means of expressing it. More power to them. I'm not a fan of Beck, or Savage, or Coulter. I give them about the same respect I give their counterparts across the aisle, like Keith Olbermann (shudder).

--- Politics ends here ---

Ranting: I did not ask people not to rant about politics; I don't believe that your freedom of expression stops when I get offended. I don't ask anyone to apologize for what they've posted before, or to apply a "Shari filter" in the future.

Shari, I don't know when you started reading here, but you are aware this board started on Salon.com, right? Liberal politics were pretty much built in from the get go.

I found the Salon board sometime in 2000, around Buffy Part 4, maybe 3, for sure by 5x5. I followed the crowd to WorldCrossing and my ID number here is 244. I know what I'm dealing with here.

So why did I jump in? I've kept my silence and skippity-skipped like a mad thing over stuff that bugged me, especially in the fall of election years, for a DECADE, y'all. And like the little Who folks on the speck of dust on Horton's flower, I just wanted to shout "I'm here!" for once.

What bugs me is not other people's views of abortion, or gay rights, or defense, or the stimulus bill, or any other issue - I can discuss those amicably. What gets me is the hate - for Cheney, for Palin, for Bush. I am very, very political; I live and breathe it. And I don't hate any of the "opponents" - not even President Obama (or as one wag called him, the "Ersatz Haderach"), who I think is going to do a lot of long-term damage to our country and the people in it. If you have room in your life to hold onto hate of a politician or the GOP (especially based on the boogeyman image you learned from Salon or Andrew Sullivan or whatever), I'm sorry for you. I don't have energy for that.

I didn't understand it when it was directed at Clinton, when it snowballed against GWBush, and when it blasted into Obama. (For eg., if you ever thought "Bushitler" was cute, don't bother complaining to me about Birthers.)

I have felt hate in some of the comments here over the years and it bothered me. Not enough to leave, or to stop caring about the people here, but enough that once in a decade I opened my mouth. If that, or anything written above really bothers you, we're even, I guess.

That and doing the "kill kill kill" thing with my fingers on a piece of paper.

"I would, but I'm paralyzed with not caring very much."

"I would, but I'm paralyzed with not caring very much."

*hearts Ginger*

if you ever thought "Bushitler" was cute

Huh, how did I miss THAT one over the years? I don't think I ever heard it! But it does not surprise me. (Don't think it's cute, though, cause it sounds in my head more like "shit" than "Hitler")

I have felt hate in some of the comments here over the years and it bothered me. Not enough to leave, or to stop caring about the people here, but enough that once in a decade I opened my mouth.

Nope, I'm sure you're right, there's been hate. And I think you're right and brave to speak up. Can't promise there won't be more, but I respect you for your thoughts. And even more for coming back after all the "but you knew we were liberals when you started!" justifications. :)

I know I'm in a tough situation. I'm going to come clean with my boss tomorrow and deal with the consequences.

I talked to my dad tonight and one thing that I realized is getting fired is not actually the worst thing that could happen. The worst would be that I go to them, I admit my mistakes, I ask for help, and I'm told that for the most part I'll just have to deal.

At some point the stupid ass spreadsheet system is going to be changed. Maybe it will be so automated and easy it won't matter if I have to answer the phones.

So I guess I'll just deal with things, try to do better, and try not to let the job stress me out too much. And sock away money like crazy to move.

A year is a long way away but I was planning on leaving around this time next year to move to Vermont.

What meara said.

Thank you, meara and Sophia. {{{{askye}}}

I want to weigh in but I skipped a bunch to get here. Let me just say I really love what a safe place this board can be for all to say what we're feeling. I'm sorry for the offense I've caused from time to time but I am awed by how gently I've been made aware of it.

Also, askye, as a person who also answers phones, I do have to tell you that people who do not answer phones have no idea how much work it is/is not possible to get done. It is pretty random. Since I am in a university system, I was able to hire a student to back me up on the phone, but I think most people assume that you can somehow concentrate with constant interruptions, an it is really hard.