Fuckadoodledoo.

I totally accept the logic of Bobby dying, although it had not crossed my mind until two minutes ago.

DO NOT WANT!

...except - I'd rather have the show make good on its potential, and not pull its punches, and break my heart. And yet at the same time I want to wrap all the characters up in cotton wool and hide them somewhere safe, with pie.

And he's totally going to find a nice woman and grab a little sugar from time to time. Which is exactly what he would call it, bless him

Ellen. It should be Ellen.

I hope that, if Bobby does bite the dust, we at least get a little bit of Ellen and/or Jo. Although at the same time I want to keep Ellen and Jo FAR AWAY FROM THE WINCHESTERS, nice and safe in that Witness Protection Scheme.

Which also plays into the whole coming-of-age theme of the show: they have to learn to stand on their own, do their own work, make their own choices--so long as Bobby's there fixing things for them, they're not full adults under the terms of the narrative.

I'm a little bit tired of the only narrative shorthand for establishing parental independence being "dead parent figure." Lots of folks mature and establish their own identity without having dead parents.

And he's going to be feeling utterly betrayed by Dean and Bobby.

But see, we've also seen him expressing regret about what he feels he has to do to... the author dude, memfault on his name. He's not excited about what he's doing, I think they're going to portray it as more of a physical addiction, which means maybe he would be more receptive to getting him off the sauce, if someone can provide a viable alternative on how they can defeat Lillith.

My fear in that case is that the writers would try to keep Sam redeemable by pulling the "the demon blood made him do it," and that would piss me off in much the same way the "magic is crack" storyline in Buffy Season Six pissed me off.

Anne is me. This storyline is already treading a fine line with me, what with him jonesing out next to the pop machine. If we're gonna blame it on the sauce, to me that's going to feel like a wasted death for Bobby.

Honestly, given the mythology that the show is drawing from, I don't think we've seen Heaven's full hand yet. Like the residents of Hell, I see there being different, possibly contrary goals at work. I think we don't know the full extent of Dean's reason for being pulled out of Hell, and I kind of think it would be awesome if no one really knew until Dean took an opportunity presented to him and its consequences have unexpected, awesome results.

Ellen. It should be Ellen.

Ohh, Bobby/Ellen, my super-secret double probation OTP.

This storyline is already treading a fine line with me, what with him jonesing out next to the pop machine.

I'm already peeved by this, too. He's INGESTING it, for one, not shooting it. I ... probably already complained about this.

I think we don't know the full extent of Dean's reason for being pulled out of Hell, and I kind of think it would be awesome if no one really knew until Dean took an opportunity presented to him and its consequences have unexpected, awesome results.

This. Castiel obviously got taken out behind the woodshed, and I'm interested to see what his change in attitude is all about, and what it means for Dean.

Which also plays into the whole coming-of-age theme of the show: they have to learn to stand on their own, do their own work, make their own choices--so long as Bobby's there fixing things for them, they're not full adults under the terms of the narrative.

I'm not sure this is entirely true. In Mystery Spot, we saw a Sam who cut Bobby off completely. If anyone is convinced he *is* a grownup and without the need for support, I think it's Sam. Asking for a hand here and there with research isn't quite the same thing.

And I agree with what Ailleann said -- having the parents dead and gone isn't the only way to achieve coming of age. One of the other themes of the show, for good or ill, is "family," and I think there are dynamics to be explored there about loyalty and obligation and love, too, obviously. Bobby may not be blood, but he is family, in the Winchester universe.

That said, I can still Kripke killing Bobby. Especially if he's sure that the fifth season will be the last. Bobby's is one of the only possible deaths left that will really resonate for Sam and Dean.

One of the other themes of the show, for good or ill, is "family," and I think there are dynamics to be explored there about loyalty and obligation and love, too, obviously. Bobby may not be blood, but he is family, in the Winchester universe.

This. I think the biggest thing that's been gumming up the Winchester works all season is that they're not trusting each other. To me (at least I hope), they're going to find a solution that comes from finally, finally working together.

Sadly, [spoiler for promos] Sam's hallucination yelling at him while wearing Dean's face doesn't promise to make that any easier.

I was thinking about Mystery Spot, and remembering how Sam took that massive chance and killed Bobby, gambling on the fact that he'd correctly gauged what was going on. Would be just awful if he ended up accidentally (or intentionally!) killing Bobby for real.

He's INGESTING it, for one, not shooting it.

I don't think I remember the scene you're talking about. Why is that important?

Well, stuff you eat is going to give you a temporary high, like ... mushrooms, for instance. It's not going to stay in your bloodstream and build up, the way shooting it would.

He's *drinking* it, is my point. But, as it's demon blood and not actual real life drugs, I guess it doesn't matter. It was just when Azazel dripped the blood in baby!Sam's mouth, I thought, "That's coming out in the diaper in a few hours," you know?

That's not really accurate. Methadone has a really long half-life and it's most commonly taken orally. Once it's in the bloodstream it doesn't really matter how it got there - the difference between shooting up and drinking is the difference between how fast it hits, not how long it lasts.

It's been weirding me out the entire time how the blood from Ruby's host body can have magical mystical properties, though. I accept it because, magic, but it so doesn't make sense to me.

well, we've seen oral transmission of supernatural powers via blood a lot in the series, though, so I figure it's par for the course. I mean, vampires just have a bad case of Evil Mono.

Supernatural is all about death, loss, and love. Yeah, there are other ways for characters to come of age, but not many that are fitting for the genre.

I accept it because, magic, but it so doesn't make sense to me.

Yeah, this. I keep having to remind myself, "Um, NOT REAL," so. And the point of the demon blood drinking gets across anyway.