Angel: If I'm not back in a couple of hours— Gunn: You're dead, we're screwed, end of the world.

'Underneath'


Supernatural 2: Why is it our job to save everybody?  

[NAFDA]. This is where we talk about the CW series Supernatural! Anything that's aired in the US on TV (including promos) is fair game. No spoilers though — if you post one by accident, an admin will delete it.


§ ita § - May 28, 2011 6:41:02 am PDT #20119 of 30002
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

I think it's definitely Sam/Dean, just PG. There are a lot of strangely longing moments. Very evocative.

I noticed a post on tumblr bitching that Meg was the only woman to make it from the first season to now.

Okay, I'm not as down on the show about gender and race as many people, but seriously? Let's take the leads out of the picture, because they don't count. One man has made it from the first season to now. So...50% male, 50% female. Yes, Bobby has a bigger role than Meg, but IT'S NOT LIKE PEOPLE SURVIVE.

If you are mad that there isn't a regular female protagonist, just damned well say so. But other than the leads, there's just one male protagonist left that recurs. Isolation is still their thing.

But this was on the tumblr of a poster that says the women are just put there for evoking responses from the men, which is patently unfair. That's not what Jo and Ellen were about. Mary was more than that. Jessica was precisely that, but she was one freaking episode.


Amy - May 28, 2011 7:43:08 am PDT #20120 of 30002
Because books.

Jessica was precisely that, but she was one freaking episode.

Even then, I feel like Jessica stood for a lot more in terms of characterizing Sam, and what he wanted and where he was in his life when the series opened. We don't ever really get to know Jess as a character in her own right (although it's hard to remember that, if you read a lot of fic), but I did like that they carried the idea of her character through to S5.


§ ita § - May 28, 2011 7:48:34 am PDT #20121 of 30002
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Also, they kill Dean to hurt Sam and kill Sam to hurt Dean, so it's not like it's an alien gender-related premise.

I think Jess was a well-done character who indicated where Sam was at the time of the pilot, and whose demise gave plausible fodder for him leaving that place. She wasn't a cardboard cutout position holder, she was an episode's worth of awesomeness.

And Mary far transcends a fridging.

I too want more rocking female characters around regularly on TV. But I really really hate when people ignore that the SPN crew has written (and then offed) self-realised independently-motivated women. They totally totally have. Vampire Diaries gets more cred than I'd ever expect for its female characters, and passes the Bechdel test regularly, but I'd not spend ten minutes of my real life with pretty much any of those women. Whereas I'd love to be Ellen or Mary's best friend, or go toe to toe with Ruby or Meg.


Anne W. - May 28, 2011 7:50:23 am PDT #20122 of 30002
The lost sheep grow teeth, forsake their lambs, and lie with the lions.

Also, they kill Dean to hurt Sam and kill Sam to hurt Dean, so it's not like it's an alien gender-related premise.

Also, in Season 1, the people Meg killed to hurt John? Caleb and Pastor Jim. Both guys.


Amy - May 28, 2011 8:16:55 am PDT #20123 of 30002
Because books.

I wonder if anyone's done an accurate running body count, by gender. Of everyone killed on the show, not just principals.


Matt the Bruins fan - May 28, 2011 9:09:20 am PDT #20124 of 30002
"I remember when they eventually introduced that drug kingpin who murdered people and smuggled drugs inside snakes and I was like 'Finally. A normal person.'” —RahvinDragand

My gut feeling would be that the opening teaser monster chow is heavily weighted to hot young women in peril, but I don't think that holds true through the show as a whole. Monsters-of-the-week and non-recurring demonic goons tend to be male, and they get Columbian necklaces as a parting gift all the time too.


Juliebird - May 28, 2011 12:01:47 pm PDT #20125 of 30002
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

That was so very Sam/Dean, the constant intimate touching (nuzzling Sam's neck?!) and the narrator going on about how blind they must be. Amy's so sweet.


Amy - May 28, 2011 12:06:44 pm PDT #20126 of 30002
Because books.

It's hard to judge! If there's no actual sex, I don't know how other people will read it!

I do love Ruthie, either way. I usually love paxlux's stuff, and I like that she experiments with style, too (and it usually pays off).


Juliebird - May 28, 2011 12:39:01 pm PDT #20127 of 30002
I am the fly who dreams of the spider

It was a really good story, and I'm not usually a fan of whatever that narrative style is called.

And while I don't think that anything physical was actually going on between the boys (it's almost like unoshot's Aurora Borealis, where it's so delicate, that you could almost go either way with friends/lovers. And like ita said, evocative while being completely PG) it wasn't platonic brotherly emotion there.


Amy - May 28, 2011 12:49:40 pm PDT #20128 of 30002
Because books.

It's second person, which can be hard to do, and not everyone likes.