Yeah, I want to know what happens when he has to pull an all-nighter.
Well, look at you. All dressed up in big sister's clothes.
Faith ,'End of Days'
Boxed Set, Vol. V: Just a Hint of Denial and a Dash of Retcon
A topic for the discussion of Doctor Who, Arrow, and The Flash. Beware possible invasions of iZombie, Sleepy Hollow, or pretty much any other "genre" (read: sci fi, superhero, or fantasy) show that captures our fancy. Expect adult content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.
Marvel superheroes are discussed over at the MCU thread.
Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.
Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.
This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.
Dana - Mar 04, 2012 9:37:12 am PST #19533 of 30001
I haven't trusted science since I saw the film "Flubber."
§ ita § - Mar 04, 2012 9:41:34 am PST #19534 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
How can he possibly have time to have 2 full lives? I don't get that. We sleep less than we are awake.
Polter-Cow - Mar 04, 2012 9:44:00 am PST #19535 of 30001
What else besides ramen can you scoop? YOU CAN SCOOP THIS WORLD FROM DARKNESS!
What dreams? Why is it obvious he dreams?
Because...that's the whole premise of the show. Hell, he even has the line about either seeing the 611 in a dream or being in a dream at the moment.
We sleep less than we are awake.
And dreams have time dilation.
§ ita § - Mar 04, 2012 9:50:10 am PST #19536 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
Because...that's the whole premise of the show
The premise of the show, in my reading, is two existences of unknown validity. You're saying it's impossible, by definition, that they're both real?
he even has the line about either seeing the 611 in a dream or being in a dream at the moment.
I don't consider him a reliable narrator. He's obviously not fully informed as to what's going on.
Right now, they could both be equally valid reality--divergent timelines; or they could both be creations of his mind brought on by some condition mental or physical; or one could be a figment of some sort and the other real--I don't see where it's definite that it's the last one.
If one of them is a dream, it's the most boring and disappointing explanation possible. I'd hate that explanation, and I'd feel like it was a retroactive waste of time. And I rarely say that about finding out a given scenario wasn't actually real.
sumi - Mar 04, 2012 9:51:33 am PST #19537 of 30001
Art Crawl!!!
Grimm: Sebastian Roche in episode 18.
le nubian - Mar 04, 2012 9:55:04 am PST #19538 of 30001
"And to be clear, I am the hell. And the high water."
ita,
I don't think you're wrong given the pilot, but I think the creators are striving for one reality being "true" and the other not.
§ ita § - Mar 04, 2012 10:12:57 am PST #19539 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
Meta knowledge aside, have we been presented with anything that supports that?
For all we know, he's the only one that died in the crash, and this is his Jacob's Ladder/Life on Mars moment as he winks out of life. It's so far just as supportable by the text, and even moreso, if information flows both way between red world and green world.
le nubian - Mar 04, 2012 10:18:55 am PST #19540 of 30001
"And to be clear, I am the hell. And the high water."
Besides he and his counselors asserting this? I guess we can choose to ignore what was presented to his counselors, but then should we ignore everything else that was presented in the episode as well? Maybe he doesn't have a son after all?
At this point, the viewer is supposed to believe that there are only 2 people (perhaps 3) who do not exist at this point in time: the counselor in the son or wife's "dream" and the son or wife. The possible third is the son's coach if the son is not the one who is still living.
Everyone else is alive and running around.
§ ita § - Mar 04, 2012 10:24:44 am PST #19541 of 30001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
Besides he and his counselors asserting this?
Him and his counsellors asserting what? His counsellors are asserting somewhat conflicting scenarios, so obviously the explanation could trivially be something that neither of them understand.
I mean, take Life on Mars. People in the past scenario asserted that they were real--does that mean they were? Turns out, it didn't. And then look how Ashes to Ashes ended. I'm not sure why this show suddenly has reliably informed narrators.
The more I talk about it, the less I like the show, I think. That's no good.
Take, for instance, Wilmer Valderama's character. Britten knew nothing about him before the crash, right? So if that isn't the correct reality, does he really exist? Take the perps--they're new people to him since the crash, so one of them doesn't exist, right? There are tons of people that are going to be new to him in either reality every week, so there are tons of people that don't exist, not just his wife or son, not just the relevant counsellor and his wife or son.
le nubian - Mar 04, 2012 10:34:54 am PST #19542 of 30001
"And to be clear, I am the hell. And the high water."
I don't know enough about "Life on Mars" to discuss it, but isn't it the case that in "Awake", both of the counselors agree that he is "dreaming" one scenario and that the other is real? I did not hear another explanation besides this posed by either counselor or the patient.
That's what I am referring to.
This is NBC, not Fox, so I think they've laid their cards on the table.
As far as the perp - didn't the perp appear in red and green-land? I think Wilmer was in both as well, just not his partner in the other.