The count of three isn't a plan. It's Sesame Street.

Buffy ,'First Date'


Natter 54: Right here, dammit.  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, duct tape, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


DavidS - Sep 24, 2007 8:13:26 pm PDT #2748 of 10001
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

Here's an account of Who Knew What When re: Auschwitz:

From October 1940, Witold Pilecki's network in the Auschwitz system sent reports to Warsaw, and beginning March 1941, Pilecki's reports were being forwarded via the Polish resistance to the British government in London. These reports were a principal source of intelligence on Auschwitz for the Western Allies. Pilecki hoped that either the Allies would drop arms or the Polish 1st Independent Parachute Brigade troops into the camp, or the Polish Home Army would organize an assault on it from outside. By 1943, however, he realized that no such plans existed. He escaped on the night of April 26–April 27, 1943, taking along documents stolen from the Germans. Pilecki's detailed report was sent to London, but the British authorities refused the Home Army air support for an operation to help the inmates escape. An air raid was considered too risky, and Home Army reports on Nazi atrocities at Auschwitz were deemed to be gross exaggerations. The Home Army in turn decided that it didn't have enough force to storm the camp by itself.

On April 7, 1944, two young Jewish inmates, Rudolf Vrba and Alfréd Wetzler, had escaped from the camp with detailed information about the camp's geography, the gas chambers, and the numbers being killed. The information, later called the Vrba-Wetzler report, is believed to have reached the Jewish community in Budapest by April 27. Roswell McClelland, the U.S. War Refugee Board representative in Switzerland, is known to have received a copy by mid-June, and sent it to the board's executive director on June 16, according to Raul Hilberg. [3] Information based on the report was broadcast on June 15 by the BBC and on June 20 by The New York Times. [4]

The British Prime Minister, Winston Churchill, did not see bombing as a solution, given that bombers were inaccurate and would also kill prisoners on the ground. The land war would have to be won first. Bombers were used against German cities and to carpet-bomb the front lines. Concerning the concentration camps, he wrote to his Foreign Secretary on 11 July 1944: "... all concerned in this crime who may fall into our hands, including the people who only obeyed orders by carrying out these butcheries, should be put to death..." [6] In August 1944, 60 tons of supplies were flown to assist the uprising in Warsaw and, considering the dropping accuracy at that time, were to be dropped "into the south-west quarter of Warsaw". Seven aircraft reached the city. [7]

So it was pretty late in the war by the time it was verified. By that point the focus was on winning the war outright.


P.M. Marc - Sep 24, 2007 8:16:01 pm PDT #2749 of 10001
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear

Lillian tried Paul's lemongrass dry soda today. Pushed it away firmly and stuck out her tongue. Not a fan.

Is that weird for here? My sister's ears were pierced at that age.

It's kind of weird, yes.


DavidS - Sep 24, 2007 8:17:34 pm PDT #2750 of 10001
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."

In Miami, it was very common for Cubans to pierce their babies ears.

So I grew up seeing babies with gold studs in their ears.


Trudy Booth - Sep 24, 2007 8:18:58 pm PDT #2751 of 10001
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart

Pierced baby ears seem fairly common among Latinos and Italian Americans around here.


BigDuluth - Sep 24, 2007 8:20:42 pm PDT #2752 of 10001
"I am the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the world"

So it was pretty late in the war by the time it was verified.

Well I guess we have to figure in the rate and amount of communication back then. Today it'd be more like

h4nuk41920: Dewd hav U s33n GodFriend1337???
t0r4hguy240: I herd he gaWt gr4bb3d by N4zi's!!!
h4nuk41920: Oh Sh1t!!11 C4ll 0th3r C0untr13s Fast!!!

That said instant messenger won't ever really reach any such standard of reliability.
edit: not to be confused for a haulocaust joke... that ain't cool


-t - Sep 24, 2007 8:22:06 pm PDT #2753 of 10001
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration

Babies with pierced ears do not seem unusual to me, but I can't place exactly where I've lived that they would have been common.


Alibelle - Sep 24, 2007 8:33:02 pm PDT #2754 of 10001
Apart from sports, "my secret favorite thing on earth is ketchup. I will put ketchup on anything. But it has to be Heinz." - my husband, Michael Vartan

Back to the wars and dead people

That barely counted, since it was actually leaning more towards your admittedly adorable daughter talk, but thank you.

Alibelle--how do I vote for your friends? if you give me a number, I'll call it.

Just so we're clear, everyone, Robin is by far my favorite of all of you. Hands down, no contest. I don't know if the phone lines are still open, but Alec and Josies's number is: 1 (800) 868-3402. You get six votes per phone line tonight, and I was having tons of trouble logging into the voting online thing at ABC.com, so I don't even know if that's worth a shot.

ETA:

In Miami, it was very common for Cubans to pierce their babies ears.

Well, that is where I spent my babyhood. So that probably explains my ears.


Typo Boy - Sep 24, 2007 9:07:20 pm PDT #2755 of 10001
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

The U.S.does have some responsibilty for WWII. The whole world stood by while Mussolini took Ethiopia. There was the civil war in Spain where Hitler and Mussolini intervened massively while the U.S. and Europe honored what was supposed to be a universal arms embargo, and the then Soviet Union gave some aid, but not as much as it could have. Spain in particular was where Hitler might have been contained or at least delayed at a low cost - simply by selling as many arms to the Loyalists as they were willing to buy -even just as many as they had actual cash for.


Jars - Sep 24, 2007 11:18:42 pm PDT #2756 of 10001

Just been reading over the last couple of hundred poosts. Sometimes, Ireland kind of sucks. We have no abortion, stayed neutral in WWII (although I still think that was the right thing to so), oh, but let a load of Nazis in after the war while turning away Jewish refugees. Lovely country I have myself here.

Though the genealogy/war conversation reminded me that my great-grandparents were tortured to death by the Japanese for leading the Malaysian guerrilla movement (according to family lore, anyway), which is cool and also tragic.

Ooh! And I just found a wiki page on my great-uncle, Uncle Don.

[link]


Theodosia - Sep 25, 2007 2:45:14 am PDT #2757 of 10001
'we all walk this earth feeling we are frauds. The trick is to be grateful and hope the caper doesn't end any time soon"

All I know about my father's WWII service is that he worked on the big cannons used in bombardments in the Pacific, and I have seen several pictures of him (so shockingly young -- he was born in 1917) in South Pacific-like locales. He was Army, so it was probably Papua-New Guinea or along that path. Will have to talk to my brother who has done more research....