And this is related, I swear, but I wonder if John knew, ever, what Mary'd done for him.

Nope. Never.

I can't see how you create the John Winchester we had with a guy who knows. This all seemed new to him.

Okay... Now I am thinking randomly about how he *might* have found out... But I have to brain on it.

Oh, and I thought that maybe the reason that the Angels "saved" Dean was to prevent him from becoming a very powerful demon - i.e., they saved him and they saved themselves.

They seem to threaten him with rehellification an awful lot for that, even though thus far, it's all been empty promises.

Yes, I don't think that they expected to actually have to send him back.

BTW, I hope they keep up the trend of having Castiel voice over the promos.

I can't see how you create the John Winchester we had with a guy who knows. This all seemed new to him.

I can. Not right away, maybe not even until after Sam left, but I can see him putting the pieces together. Maybe not being certain, but he knows the demon came into those homes, he knows that they had plans for the children, knows something happened, knew Elkins, so he probably found out about his would-have-been-in-laws at some point, remembers blacking out and waking up in Mary's lap, her father dead next to them, her mother dead at home, her neck snapped by something stronger than your regular man.

Oh, and I thought that maybe the reason that the Angels "saved" Dean was to prevent him from becoming a very powerful demon - i.e., they saved him and they saved themselves.

It's a very Winchester-specific 'verse, this could make sense.

I can. Not right away, maybe not even until after Sam left, but I can see him putting the pieces together. Maybe not being certain, but he knows the demon came into those homes, he knows that they had plans for the children, knows something happened, knew Elkins, so he probably found out about his would-have-been-in-laws at some point, remembers blacking out and waking up in Mary's lap, her father dead next to them, her mother dead at home, her neck snapped by something stronger than your regular man.

You know, sometimes having Plei in your head is weird, but not when she is way better at saying the things you are thinking about thinking. This!

You know, sometimes having Plei in your head is weird, but not when she is way better at saying the things you are thinking about thinking. This!

It's not like I've watch In the Beginning so many times that I've lost count or anything weird or obsessive like that. I mean, umm.

Okay, maybe it is.

And of course, you are totally alone in that.

No, that'd be weird or obsessive, no.

Yeah...

Alastair is a little too Brando for me. I loved the voice he used just at first but as the ep progressed, a little ... Brando. Apocalypse Brando, when he was amazing but also hugely over the top and bombastic.

Oooh, Castiel kept his eyes open when Anna ... did whatever reGraced angels do.

Sam really will forgive Dean anything, I think. I like this. Doesn't bode well for the world, but I like it.

Of course! None of the rest of you have EVER considered that a fine way to pass your car-free commute.

That episode hit me so hard, I couldn't watch Sarah Connor Chronicles until this week (I'm now almost caught up with it) because if I went to watch something on the phone, it was always ItB.

So Dean's slept with an angel who chose to fall, cutting out her own grace so she could feel things as a human does. Sam slept with a demon who's been choosing to unfall, or whatever, because she remembers feeling things as a human.

Sam has been carrying the weight of his demon blood. Dean's been carrying the weight of his, for want of a better term, demon internship/training/coursework.

I feel like I'm on the cusp of some words involving the boys' journeys on separate paths with the same destination, and Ruby and Anna's similarities and the whole heaven and hell as a metaphor.