I'm frazzeled too, and a little bit confused.

I think that one of the reasons voting may or may not work is very dependant on the individual proposer. The original idea of leaving the vote up to the proposer is, in my view, that they would take away a sense of the arguments and change and refine the vote until it could reflect all possibilities, which, in some ways, is certainly hindered by having to have a yes/no vote. It is a lot of work, and frankly the work of proposing the first vote about whether or not we should vote sucked a lot of the joy out of this board for me. I think we have gotten to the point where it is hard for one person to synthesize the arguments and I think this is what a poll would help.

Is there any kind of tool that can tell how often lurkers pull us up? I've begun wondering how many lurkers vote and whether we're just a big soap opera to someone out there who could care less what happens so long as we're entertaining. I've also wondered how many of our approximately 1500 members are actual accounts that check in on a weekly/monthly basis and how many are never used.

I really think this is a good idea.

In the last several polls about thread closure/creation we've had 100 or less people voting. I really think it would be helpful to find out how many people post/read the board on a regular basis vs how many people are voting.

Could we also do a poll that asked which threads people participate in? People are saying that Natter and Bitches are the core of the community, but I'd like to know how many people use other threads but don't consider Natter/Bitches their core board experience.

Someone, I think Bev, suggested posting announcements in all the threads and again I think that's a good idea. Yes, we have Press for these kinds of things, but there may be people who don't read Press and I think this discussion is important enough we really need to encourage people to participate in voting and the discussion since this is really important.

Polling is just our latest attempt to rush headlong into a new solution (see also: experimental threads). This is going to turn out badly, said Cassandra.

Here is what is going to happen with the polls:

We will set up as thorough and definitive a set of questions and answers as we can muster and collect a massive amount of seemingly useful data.

We will convene back here to discuss the results.

There will be approximately twelve squillion equally reasonable interpretations of the poll results. Each of these interpretations will be challenged by an additional twelve squillion people chiming in and saying "Well, I only answered XYZ because PQR weren't on there as options. Here's how I really feel..."

Rinse, repeat.

I suspect if we had access to a TARDIS, Bureaucraxxxy 327: Like Tolstoy, Only Longer would show us Emeline, Lily, Grace, Noah and Dylan bemoaning their inability to satisfactorily discuss whatever has replaced television in the future, and wondering why their parents thought Boxed Set was a good idea in the first place. And then setting up a poll to decide what once and for all how the problem could best be solved.

I'm much too busy and frazzled to contribute much of value right now, but I do want to thank David for the sprawl metaphor. It's exactly right for my feelings about board growth, and it's the reason the thought of a dozen more single-show threads made me (metaphorically) cry when I was even more frazzled and not articulating real arguments yesterday.

I know how you feel. I am panicked at what is happening right now, that there really is a half-baked plan to overhaul the board.

There will be approximately twelve squillion equally reasonable interpretations of the poll results. Each of these interpretations will be challenged by an additional twelve squillion people chiming in and saying "Well, I only answered XYZ because PQR weren't on there as options. Here's how I really feel..."

Exactly.

If we do a poll on board useage, I'd like to see a question about how people physically navigate the board. As a "Read New" user, I think my feelings about whitefont are different from a thread-clicker's.

bon - What would ease your frustration here? leave things alone?

and for those that doubt that the poll will help anything, do you have any ideas of what will?

I am still puzzled by the idea of voting to shut up discussions. First off, it never does. and second, lightbulbs and this thread are so easy to just leave when you hate a discussion. If I stop reading the annoying debate, then it is just like it shutting up.

I think the poll, should a poll happen, should include a question about general satisfaction with the board:

Do you like b.org the way it is? What would be the one thing you would add to it? remove from it? If you have dissatisfaction, can you pinpoint reasons why? things too fast/too slow/people no longer here/people I don't know/discussion in places I can't go/not the discussions I want/general malaise for "the way things were"/I like being upset so I'll never be happy with anything/other

When I have heard people raising the point of being unhappy with boards (certainly not just here) I remember reasons often being things out of the control of the boards. Boards do change and honestly sometimes we all need to take a break of find a new place to spend some of online time.

bon - What would ease your frustration here? leave things alone?

Of course! Or, at least, creating threads when there's a clearly articulated need, rather than polling to find out needs that seemingly can't be otherwise discovered or articulated. Jeez, how did this happen? I am sure I am annoying people, but this is the not a good way to find a "solution" to individual difficulties.

and a proposal being made, discussed and passed is not an articulated need?

Well sure, I agree it is not a need, it is a want.

And I didn't see at least the initial poll to be about thread creation at all, just about gathering board usage and satisfaction data. Not a decision being made at all.

But they're lurkers -- would they respond?

This is not so much on the point but...

I sometimes wonder how others perceive me (or if they perceive me at all). I've followed this entire discussion and the entire one on creating the SPN thread, but I'm not sure I ever posted. Most of my time reading posts is done in big chunks. I don't think of myself as a lurker - I think of myself as a buffistas, but one who doesn't have a chance to post often.

I have opinions on the issue at hand, but since I'm always catching up 30+ posts at a time, it seems that someone else has covered it already. I do like the idea of a poll though.

Most of my time reading posts is done in big chunks. I don't think of myself as a lurker - I think of myself as a buffistas, but one who doesn't have a chance to post often.

I think of those as totally different things. And I'd definitely consider you the latter.