No problem. I just hate to see you guys over here agonizing over trying to be fair to everybody, when if he put even half that effort into monitoring his own behavior, there wouldn't be a problem. Some people just don't "get it" because they simply don't want to. No amount of words, explanations or warnings from any of you, logical though they may be, can fix that. You guys run a great board. If he doesn't want to acclimate himself to become a part of it...*shrugs*...the hell with him.

Thanks, Denise - well said.

Also well said...

Please have respect for our there-when-you-got-there mores. If you offend them without having intended to, we will tell you, politely, as we do and did; then, your path is (I feel) to absolutely take a polite, apologetic tone. If you feel you were warned too hastily, or within a double standard, you absolutely may argue with us; but your basic tone *must* be a polite one. This is our sandbox. You are the newbie. Argue; but you must be brilliant to make us change our minds about something we've already had sixty thousand posts in the Bureaucracy thread about; but, then again, it is possible. Be polite and brilliant. Certainly. Surprise us.

This could almost go in the FAQ. And Kristen's point is also valuable. His lack of responsiveness to being told he was offensive is telling. It's a good Red Flag for all of us to keep in mind when we're looking at these situations.

I just hate to see you guys over here agonizing over trying to be fair to everybody, when if he put even half that effort into monitoring his own behavior, there wouldn't be a problem.

Ah, this isn't agonizing. You should've seen it before we set this board up. That was a lengthy discussion. Actually, I think these are good test cases for us to learn how to patrol our beat. We do prefer to err on the side of inclusiveness - that's always been a strong community value.

The Constitutional argument about the managing of just this kind of situation went on and on and on ... ::sigh:: It was good we did it, though. I'm very glad we have a process in place.

It's funny. Generally I get very, well, stressed in an internet dispute. I know from experience that logic and courtesy won't win the day, and that I'm going to walk away upset and dissatisfied. Sometimes I lose sleep going over what I should have said and how could they say that?

But I'm not upset here, today. I'm quite calm, not bothered about the poster's presence or the board response. Because I feel supported by the community and the board, and I'm secure in the knowledge that we have the tools to effect a change if necessary. It's quite liberating.

Rock on, Buffistas. Every day this community surprises me a little more, and in a good way.

If he gets defensive and nasty if the Stompy Feet have to intervene again can his post about not caring if he steps on anyone's toes be used against him?

Also, I'm wondering if this happens in the future and we realise that the troll won't starve, if there should be an effort to have anyone/everyone who finds the posts offensive to say something, even if it's just one little line while trying to get the topic back on topic.

It's not that this guy doesn't get that he's offending people, he just doesn't care and he hasn't shown that he wants to change.

I thought we'd have more time before we'd have to deal with all of this--the population explosion, the troll issues, everything.

But I'm not upset here, today. I'm quite calm, not bothered about the poster's presence or the board response. Because I feel supported by the community and the board, and I'm secure in the knowledge that we have the tools to effect a change if necessary. It's quite liberating.

See, this is an affirmation of the hard work put in by so many people to decide just how we would want this place to present itself. I'd like to reiterate as well that this place is truly something special.

Well, he's also shut up for the moment (although that may have more to do with having RL issues to deal with rather than the board), so perhaps the Stompy Foot warning was sufficient.

I'll expect we'll find out soon enough.

Having been one of the more vocal worrywarts in the wake of Joss' delurk, I think I should mention something encouraging. My misgivings about the membership boom seem to have been largely unwarranted... we've had one obvious troll and one debatable case out of over 200 new members, and been blessed with a much larger number of newbies who've seamlessly joined the discussions with their own polite and insightful points of view. That's a great relief compared to my previous experiences with other boards where the bad apple share was considerably higher than 1%. All the more so because it's happening at a time when unfortunate outside circumstances have upped the stress level of the thread drawing in the bulk of new members.

Thanks for speaking up, Denise. And it isn't just this one poster we're discussing here, but similar situations in the future. This one may not be worth the time and effort, but maintaining the community against multiple assaults certainly is worth it.

I love the Buffistas. IJS.