You two carried me through that war. Now I need you to carry me just a little bit further. If you can.

Tracy ,'The Message'


Premium Cable: The Cursing Costs Extra

[NAFDA] A thread for the discussion of all original programming on HBO, Showtime, Starz and other premium channels.

This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.


Sean K - Apr 09, 2012 6:22:32 pm PDT #4334 of 7329
You can't leave me to my own devices; my devices are Nap and Eat. -Zenkitty

Time for a big GoT meara...

Janos Slynt doesn't seem sleazy enough to me - he's the only major casting misstep I can think of so far. Everyone else is spot on.

I think he's perfect, because he comes across as so not-sleazy. I always had the impression that for as much of a scumbag as Slynt is, it wasn't something you could tell just from his appearance or outward manner. I imagine it's why Ned Stark never saw Slynt's betrayal coming.

Cersei--I have no idea if she's cooler than in the books

Cersei is one of the more irredeemable characters in the books. Let's just say that Joffrey is his mother's son. And as mentioned elsewhere, the over-the-top-ness of Joffrey is spot-on. He's that bat-shit evil in the books.

and I do understand that Robb is getting extra time,

Meh, not really, AFAIC. So far, all of the stuff with Robb more or less happens in the books, it just happens primarily through Caitlin's eyes.

I don't think she's a POV character in the books until #3 and by then our view of her is so skewed by how she's perceived by others that it's hard to shake off.

Book 4!

Willingly participating in a gang rape of his own wife does not, to me, indicate a strong moral compass.

I hesitate to call that "willing". Nobody put a gun to his head, but he was targeted by a pretty serious mind fuck by his father. It was an outcome explicitly and knowingly arranged by Tywin Lannister. Tyron was a victim in that event as well, though not an equal victim by any stretch.

But I don't think you can look honestly at the actions of any of them and say Tyrion is objectively a better or nicer person than his siblings.

However, I agree with this completely. He does different things from his brother and sister, and his sympathies and empathies lie in very different places from theirs, but that doesn't really make him a better person, per se.

But I also think that the only truly honorable or good person as we generally understand it, lost his head to his own sword at the end of last season.

he spends a good amount of time trying to do the right thing (and mostly getting shit on for it).

I think any of the things Tyrion tries to do aligning with what we the readers/fans think is the right thing to do is purely coincidental. Tyrion is not motivated by goodness or honor and any other motivation that someone actually trying to do the right thing is operating from. Like Al Swearingen, do not mistake the character doing the "right thing" in any particular instance for the character actually wanting to do the right thing or be a good or even a "better" person.

Show!Joffrey is exactly as I pictured him in the books. He starts out as a sniveling little shit, and turns into a sniveling little shit with a crown. His excessive cruelty is noted in the books even by the other "evil" characters.

Yes, this. He was raised to be this person. He's a deliberate creation who grows well beyond the control of his creator (Cersei).

Is this a good pitch for Sansa (thematically spoilery, I guess, although it doesn't refer to any precise events from the books, really). It's making a case that she's the best character, pretty much--not just in the book, but across a fandom deathmatch.

It's an interesting take on Sansa. I started off not liking her very much, and continued that way for a while, but she's slowly won me over in the books. And I think she changes and grows a little more than that pitch might have you believe, but who she's becoming has yet to really be delved into quite as much as some of the other characters.


Sean K - Apr 09, 2012 6:27:29 pm PDT #4335 of 7329
You can't leave me to my own devices; my devices are Nap and Eat. -Zenkitty

Oh, and I thought Balon Greyjoy was SUPER-FREAKIN' AWESOME!


Sean K - Apr 09, 2012 6:34:56 pm PDT #4336 of 7329
You can't leave me to my own devices; my devices are Nap and Eat. -Zenkitty

In fact, I'll be honest and say that while Dany is probably my favorite character, 'cuz dragons, if we were to go all Team Edward/Team Jacob on the Westeros houses, I'm Team Greyjoy all the way.

Because dragons drown, just like lions and wolves and stags and everything else.

That which is dead may never die.

(I'm missing Aeron Damphair quite a bit, but I understand why he probably won't show up.)


Theodosia - Apr 10, 2012 2:43:08 am PDT #4337 of 7329
'we all walk this earth feeling we are frauds. The trick is to be grateful and hope the caper doesn't end any time soon"

I'd respect Baptists more if they operated like Aeron Damphair.


sumi - Apr 10, 2012 8:09:13 am PDT #4338 of 7329
Art Crawl!!!

He is hardcore. None of this dipping nonsense - only actual drowning.


Jessica - Apr 10, 2012 11:19:37 am PDT #4339 of 7329
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

The Greyjoys bore the shit out of me. If the whole of the Iron Islands sunk into the sea, I'd hope that Asha was away for the weekend and then throw a party.

Sansa and Bran are probably the most morally upstanding POV characters, for sure. But unfortunately, nice isn't as interesting as smart, and she doesn't have any dragons.

[And since this is the show thread and not Literary, by Asha I mean Yara.]


Sean K - Apr 10, 2012 11:46:54 am PDT #4340 of 7329
You can't leave me to my own devices; my devices are Nap and Eat. -Zenkitty

My further comments on who bores the shit out of me involve people who haven't even been mentioned in the TV show, so I made that comment on my FB thread, Jess.

This show is hard to discuss with non-readers, because it's so tempting to discuss it within the framework of future events from the books. For example it seems to me like they're taking more liberties this season than last, but doing it in such a way as to signal to readers that they have every intention of following through on the more important, bizarro and messed up, how-the-hell-are-they-going-to-pull-that-off stuff yet to come.


chrismg - Apr 13, 2012 6:54:09 pm PDT #4341 of 7329
"...and then Legolas and the Hulk destroy the entire Greek army." - Penny Arcade

Rewatching GoT S1, something just jumped out at me: Ned has a sit-down talk with Arya about how they've come to a dangerous place and have to pull together as a family. We never see him do the same with Sansa and, given subsequent events, it seems likely he didn't. Either he thought because she was older, or because she wasn't making a fuss like Arya was, or....well, he definitely assumed when he shouldn't have.


Frankenbuddha - Apr 15, 2012 5:10:20 pm PDT #4342 of 7329
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"

Dear lord Peter Dinklage is a national treasure. I gotta go with Lena Heady here - what she said upon meeting him for the first time her first thought was "Wow, he really is that short." Second thought was "Wow, he is really good looking."


-t - Apr 15, 2012 5:24:27 pm PDT #4343 of 7329
I am a woman of various inclinations and only some of the time are they to burn everything down in frustration

Alas, poor Yoren. That was a very Boromir-like death.

I love pragmatic Maergery.

Yay for more Daenarys next week! Not that I would have cut anything out of this episode, but I missed her.