Yes. Lucky for you, people may be in danger.

Buffy ,'Him'


Boxed Set, Vol. III: "That Can't Be Good..."  

A topic for the discussion of Farscape, Smallville, and Due South. Beware possible invasions of Stargate, Highlander, or pretty much any other "genre" show that captures our fancy. Expect Adult Content and discussion of the Big Gay Sex.

Whitefont all unaired in the U.S. ep discussion, identifying it as such, and including the show and ep title in blackfont.

Blackfont is allowed after the show has aired on the east coast.

This is NOT a general TV discussion thread.


§ ita § - Nov 16, 2006 8:25:52 am PST #3695 of 10001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

Antarctic! Thanks. I tried to google, and it was not useful.

I think the guy forgets that humans are the ones consuming the stories, and that fiction has...mechanisms. Sometimes emotional impact is the point, not equations.

Yeah, there are lazy writers. But there are also writers whose goal wasn't what this guy thinks their goal should have been--and that's not his call.


tommyrot - Nov 16, 2006 8:28:30 am PST #3696 of 10001
Sir, it's not an offence to let your cat eat your bacon. Okay? And we don't arrest cats, I'm very sorry.

His thing about spaceships all having a top and botton is annoying. OK, lets say a spaceship is a sphere or a cylinder. You'd constantly be seeing people with different vertical orientations, and/or people making the transition from one vertical orientation to another. It would be a big PITA to write, produce and direct, and it'd have little or no dramatic benefit.

eta: The Death Star is a sphere, but it's big enough that they never have to show these issues.


tommyrot - Nov 16, 2006 8:34:08 am PST #3697 of 10001
Sir, it's not an offence to let your cat eat your bacon. Okay? And we don't arrest cats, I'm very sorry.

Oh, and if spaceships moved with 100% accurate Newtonian physics and orbital mechanics, the results would be weird and not very exciting. I know that spaceship movement is almost never depicted 100% correctly (according to our understanding of physics) but I suspend my disbelief unless the offense is especially egregious.


Theodosia - Nov 16, 2006 8:41:06 am PST #3698 of 10001
'we all walk this earth feeling we are frauds. The trick is to be grateful and hope the caper doesn't end any time soon"

At least with Stargates, the natives have an actual reason to hang out in one geographical region, since that would give them readier access to it.


Jessica - Nov 16, 2006 8:54:41 am PST #3699 of 10001
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

I have to say, while his examples mostly suck, I have to agree with him that the "nonhumans who want to become human" trope is annoying and overused, especially when it shows up in conjunction with "love is a human emotion." Blargh.

But spaceships have a top and a bottom because they're going to be manned by people who grew up on planets, and expect their vehicles to have tops and bottoms. Once we all agree that interstellar travel is science fiction, I don't think it's a huge stretch to assume that we've also invented a workable artificial gravity by that point.


§ ita § - Nov 16, 2006 8:59:47 am PST #3700 of 10001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

And even when the society moves to the point where the inhabitants of a ship don't need up and down, we still will be most comfortable viewing that. And it'll be cheaper, most often.

The Pinocchio/Pygmalion stories don't bother me much, not if they're well done. Data did bother me. He was boring, and his desire didn't add much to the character or most of the storylines.


Jessica - Nov 16, 2006 9:11:53 am PST #3701 of 10001
And then Ortus came and said "It's Ortin' time" and they all Orted off into the sunset

I think as long as there are valid reasons for the nonhumans to be obsessed with humanity, that kind of story can work,, but I was still pumping my fist in Matrix Reloaded when Neo was all "but love is a human emotion!" and the programs were all "Um...nsm."

It's Humanity Sue stories that bug me -- random other species encountering us in space who are instantly impressed with what a beautiful and unique snowflake of a species we are.


tommyrot - Nov 16, 2006 9:13:44 am PST #3702 of 10001
Sir, it's not an offence to let your cat eat your bacon. Okay? And we don't arrest cats, I'm very sorry.

Yeah, at least the Cylons don't do that. They're all, "Humanity sucks. God loves us more."


Katie M - Nov 16, 2006 9:18:26 am PST #3703 of 10001
I was charmed (albeit somewhat perplexed) by the fannish sensibility of many of the music choices -- it's like the director was trying to vid Canada. --loligo on the Olympic Opening Ceremonies

At least with Stargates, the natives have an actual reason to hang out in one geographical region, since that would give them readier access to it.

I've always kind of thought they should be moving away from it, all "huh, you know, this thing never brings us anything but trouble. Let's try living a couple days' walk away!"

Well, in SG-1, anyway. In SGA they do seem to actually trade with other worlds and so on. But in SG-1, you could avoid so much trouble with the Goa'uld if you just moved a few days' walk away!


§ ita § - Nov 16, 2006 9:21:55 am PST #3704 of 10001
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.

you could avoid so much trouble with the Goa'uld if you just moved a few days' walk away!

They managed to spread all over Earth without any trouble. I don't think other planets would pose an insurmountable problem.

They're all, "Humanity sucks. God loves us more."

However they still want to breed with people, and live on Earth. Wanting to be newer better humans still speaks of an obsession with our race.

For anything made by us in our image--I think wanting to be us or wanting to leapfrog us is part and parcel of doing the job well. Not inevitable, but understandable.