Does anybody else miss the Mayor? 'I just want to be a big snake.'

Xander ,'End of Days'


Natter 45: Smooth as Billy Dee Williams.  

Off-topic discussion. Wanna talk about corsets, duct tape, or physics? This is the place. Detailed discussion of any current-season TV must be whitefonted.


Nutty - Jul 26, 2006 11:24:34 am PDT #8881 of 10002
"Mister Spock is on his fanny, sir. Reports heavy damage."

Well, FWIW, there are lots of people who don't fit any standard definition of insane who do awful things to their children, up to and including murder. Every day, and usually don't go to prison for it.

The whole point of an insanity plea is "if I had been in my right mind, I wouln'da done it." (The legal definition of insane is a lack of ability to discern right from wrong.) So, not really an excuse so much as a description of circumstances. Also, IIRC, the worst part of that whole story was that her husband knew she was coming apart at the seams and discouraged her from seeking help for it.


Cashmere - Jul 26, 2006 11:30:05 am PDT #8882 of 10002
Now tagless for your comfort.

Not only that, she'd had post-partum psychosis with each of their kids. It got worse every time and they continued to have more children. She was on and off of medication and her husband left her alone with their children when he KNEW she was off her meds and batshit crazy.

She's not walking around free. Go visit a state mental hospital. It's worse than prison, seriously. She needs to be in a mental hospital because she's mentally ill.


Aims - Jul 26, 2006 11:32:46 am PDT #8883 of 10002
Shit's all sorts of different now.

But if she's in the hospital...a state mental ward, she's not getting away with anything. Seriously.

I know. But...it feels like she is. And I worry that one day, after awhile of being on her meds, that she'll be released.

Well, FWIW, there are lots of people who don't fit any standard definition of insane who do awful things to their children, up to and including murder. Every day, and usually don't go to prison for it.

And this makes me just as angry.

the worst part of that whole story was that her husband knew she was coming apart at the seams and discouraged her from seeking help for it.

He also encouraged her to have Mary, the youngest, after her shrink told them that if she had another child, she'd go back to being psychotic.

Personally, I think he should have been charged with 2nd degree murder because of gross negligence.

The legal definition of insane is a lack of ability to discern right from wrong.

Right, but still? Doesn't make it any better for me. If you couldn't tell once, who's to say you won't be able to tell the difference again?


Aims - Jul 26, 2006 11:33:57 am PDT #8884 of 10002
Shit's all sorts of different now.

Go visit a state mental hospital. It's worse than prison, seriously.

I know they are. I've been. But she could be released.

She needs to be in a mental hospital because she's mentally ill.

I agree, but she should not ever have the chance of leaving. Ever.


Typo Boy - Jul 26, 2006 11:34:48 am PDT #8885 of 10002
Calli: My people have a saying. A man who trusts can never be betrayed, only mistaken.Avon: Life expectancy among your people must be extremely short.

People also get out of prisons.


Aims - Jul 26, 2006 11:36:22 am PDT #8886 of 10002
Shit's all sorts of different now.

With her original verdict, she would have been eligible for parole in 35 years.


Trudy Booth - Jul 26, 2006 11:37:43 am PDT #8887 of 10002
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart

I don't think there's much chance of her ever getting out. She's been medicated in prison for a while now and is still pretty far gone.

And she's 42. Even if she did one day get out its unlikely she could have any more children.


Fred Pete - Jul 26, 2006 11:38:56 am PDT #8888 of 10002
Ann, that's a ferret.

Her (now ex) husband put up the fight for the insanity ruling.

the worst part of that whole story was that her husband knew she was coming apart at the seams and discouraged her from seeking help for it.

He also encouraged her to have Mary, the youngest, after her shrink told them that if she had another child, she'd go back to being psychotic.

Which is why I consider him morally responsible. At minimum.

I don't do criminal law, so I won't analyze on that score.


Cashmere - Jul 26, 2006 11:40:46 am PDT #8889 of 10002
Now tagless for your comfort.

I get that it's awful and I get that people want this woman locked up because she committed the act. But I get really, really pissed when people automatically assume that pleading mentally ill is a cop out of some sort.

People DO NOT get treatment for mental illness in prison--I can personally attest to this fact. Not even the most seriously ill people. They are a danger to themselves, other prisoners and prison guards and personnel. Shutting them away in a prison cell because they committed a crime doesn't make them not sick. Their illness tends to get a lot worse when left untreated and in the stressful situation behind bars.

I've dealt with a schizophrenic brother in prison. I had to fight tooth and nail to get him what little treatment he did get. He got worse when he was there. Had he been able to spend his two years in a mental hospital, that might not have happened.


Trudy Booth - Jul 26, 2006 11:42:28 am PDT #8890 of 10002
Greece's financial crisis threatens to take down all of Western civilization - a civilization they themselves founded. A rather tragic irony - which is something they also invented. - Jon Stewart

The husband fucked up big, he definately bears some responsibility. But it seems as if he's taken responsibility in the ways open to him. He's remarried yet he is still caring for the ex wife he helped drive nuts. He really could act all self-righteous and walk away but he hasn't.

It's just tragedy on tragedy.