OK. I'm confused. But maybe that's because my first boyfriend was a Steve.

Did he like carrots? Or Bob?

There's a middle ground that goes from readable gestures to having the talk that I'd hope scares the beejeezus out of everyone, just because it makes me catch my own breath.

Yes, mucho scary.

There's also the fact that I rarely trust myself to be reading the signs correctly. And there are times when I completely miss the signs and have a sudden epiphany months or years later when it's completely moot.

What do people think about the connection between crushes/pining/unrequited obsession and relationships? I've never had both with the same person, so crushing always seems a little destined to fail to me. I'm sure there's a BMECT! out there

I had one instance of pining turn into a relationship, but it was years after the fact. She'd actually gone off to college and then had a life of her own and I just plain didn't see her for years. The pining was long done by the time we reconnected, so I guess it doesn't really count.

Part of the issue with crushes (and pining) for me has always been I have an existing friendship with the person I value and don't want to risk ruining. There is a major potential for uncomfortableness if one friend has feelings the other doesn't share. Plus, even if the person does reciprocate, if the relationship fails there's always a good chance the friendship could fail with it.

I've been really lucky in the latter regard, as all my exes have remained my friends, though there's a level of tension with one that didn't exist before our relationship, which is unfortunate.

And there are times when I completely miss the signs and have a sudden epiphany months or years later when it's completely moot.

I've done this, repeatedly. Someday someone will offer a "Human Interactions: Signals and Signs" class at the local community college and I will be the first one to sign up for it.

There's also the fact that I rarely trust myself to be reading the signs correctly. And there are times when I completely miss the signs and have a sudden epiphany months or years later when it's completely moot.

This is totally me. For values of "times" = always.

To me "nice" is opening the door and noticing my hair and picking up the tab and laughing at my jokes and making me laugh and being pleasant to the server...

Things like that. Its not that any one of those things is IMPORTANT, its the pattern of just being a pleasant and kind human being. And I like it a lot.

But that's enough if he's not also interesting too. OTOH, if a guy is fascinating and does none of that stuff you don't so much notice until you're hooked and making excuses for his being anywhere from somewhat inconsiderate to something more along the lines of a self-centered, manipulative, selfish, teenager in a grown man's body who happens to fuck really really well.

Hypothetically speaking.

Did he like carrots? Or Bob?

It's been a long time, but as I remember, the answers are, "Yes," and, "I don't know -- I don't remember any mutual acquaintances of that name."

A former boss was named Bob. Steve never met him, but I don't think he'd have liked him. The less said about that Bob, the better.

The less said about that Bob, the better.

That flies in the face of everything I've ever known about Bob. My worldview is crumbling.

Bob was the name of my computer in college. Bob was popular but kinda square.

Someday someone will offer a "Human Interactions: Signals and Signs" class at the local community college and I will be the first one to sign up for it.

Someone could make a fortune with that one, I think.

This is totally me. For values of "times" = always.

My friends and I have a little term for that. Anytime one of us is being oblivious to signs (or realizing we've missed them our selves) we'll say "Three inches thick", in reference to the oblivious one's skull.

Such as:

1: "So what's going on with you and Jenny?"

2: "What do you mean?"

1: "Dude, three inches thick!"

I have no idea what's going on with all this Bob and Steve stuff.

Cluelessness never went away for me in general, though. I'm married and didn't exactly live the life of monk beforehand, but here's an incident for example: after leaving a work-related meeting/facility tour recently, I mentioned to my boss & co-worker that I thought the woman leading the tour was rude because she'd hardly looked at or spoken to me. They both burst out laughing and said that she was completely into me. That they'd been whispering jokes to each other throughout how she wanted to be my girlfriend. I dunno. I thought eye contact was an important indication of attraction, and this woman met my eye maybe once.