Are you missing the point of my question, David?
Hey, I've been in a firefight before! Well, I was in a fire. Actually, I was fired from a fry-cook opportunity. I can handle myself.
Wash ,'War Stories'
Literary Buffistas 3: Don't Parse the Blurb, Dear.
There's more to life than watching Buffy the Vampire Slayer! No. Really, there is! Honestly! Here's a place for Buffistas to come and discuss what it is they're reading, their favorite authors and poets. "Geez. Crack a book sometime."
§ ita § - Nov 15, 2013 9:18:05 am PST #21624 of 28370
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
DavidS - Nov 15, 2013 9:24:28 am PST #21625 of 28370
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."
Are you missing the point of my question, David?
I thought Jesse already addressed your question with the "Capital L" literature. Which I think is correct.
I just disagreed with her characterization of Capital L Literature.
So I really wasn't addressing your question at all - though it was a perfectly valid question.
Did I miss something else?
shrift - Nov 15, 2013 9:36:08 am PST #21626 of 28370
"You can't put a price on the joy of not giving a shit." -Zenkitty
I don't think occasionally including women and/or POC on their "Capital L" literature lists counterbalances the domination of Straight White Dude angst.
Jesse - Nov 15, 2013 9:36:15 am PST #21627 of 28370
Sometimes I trip on how happy we could be.
Although, for what it's worth, I remember Barnes & Noble as having both "fiction" and "literature" sections, in addition to all of the ones in that sentence you quoted (and more).
Steph L. - Nov 15, 2013 9:38:27 am PST #21628 of 28370
this mess was yours / now your mess is mine
I don't think occasionally including women and/or POC on their "Capital L" literature lists counterbalances the domination of Straight White Dude angst.
Right. Including Toni Morrison is textbook exceptionalism, not a redefining of capital-L "Literature."
Amy - Nov 15, 2013 9:48:06 am PST #21629 of 28370
Because books.
It's mostly Straight White Dude Angst, but the line for me usually falls between Books They Will Give Nobels and Bookers To, and Books They Won't.
Polter-Cow - Nov 15, 2013 9:52:47 am PST #21630 of 28370
What else besides ramen can you scoop? YOU CAN SCOOP THIS WORLD FROM DARKNESS!
Right. Including Toni Morrison is textbook exceptionalism, not a redefining of capital-L "Literature."
I was surprised to see more POC than expected when I looked at the list of all Nobel Prizes in Literature. I thought Toni Morrison was, like, the only one ever, which is why David called her out, but there are several.
Kat - Nov 15, 2013 12:07:39 pm PST #21631 of 28370
"I keep to a strict diet of ill-advised enthusiasm and heartfelt regret." Leigh Bardugo
It's mostly Straight White Dude Angst, but the line for me usually falls between Books They Will Give Nobels and Bookers To
Except the Booker is more apt to be non white guys than the Nobels (probably because it is for the book not the author's body of work). Hence a historical fiction turning Thomas Cromwell into an amazingly page-turning bromance is a Booker winner. Twice.
I think the Capital-L literature is more about un-fun character studies as opposed to fiction which is about engaging plots. It's like oatmeal books vs. cheeseburger books.
§ ita § - Nov 18, 2013 7:24:13 am PST #21632 of 28370
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I missed that Doris Lessing died yesterday: [link]
Amy - Nov 19, 2013 11:41:39 am PST #21633 of 28370
Because books.
I don't disagree with the author's points about Twilight, but I think she completely misses the mark when it comes to Katniss Everdeen. And as much as I love Little Women (and I still do), her ideas about Jo March really don't seem to consider that Jo is a trailblazer only within a very limited framework.
Grumble grumble.