And another one-- gotten. Clark says gotten, fine. Lex says gotten, fine. Harry Potter, on the other hand, does not say gotten. He doesn't even *think* gotten. This story is rapidly losing me because of that...

makes note to listen very carefully when beta says 'this is not right'

Probably serial...

This was only distracting when she referred to a male character putting on a "jumper," which in U.S.ian terms, is a sort of sleeveless dress that invariably makes one look pregnant.

What is USian for a jumper, then? Sweater?

Yep, sweater.

What is USian for a jumper, then? Sweater?

Yes. I was able to overlook most of her Britishisms (which tended to be the sorts of words or phrases that she might not have realized were unique to British English), but this one knocked me out of the story for a minute or two. Fortunately, it was easy to get back into the flow of things.

Right, thanks. I'm suddenly in a mood to check every word in my current Smallville story, just in case there's something in there that would annoy other people as much.

Right. I'm suddenly in a mood to check every word in my current Smallville story, just in case there's something in there that would annoy other people as much.

Nah. That's the sort of thing a U.S. beta would be able to do without nearly as much soul-searching and second-guessing oneself.

I think it's often a double-standard in fandom -- Brits bemoan American negligence, and often don't realize (realise!) that the same thing applies in reverse. We used to have delightfully funny and informative conversations about these things with Fay, in Natter mostly. "Pants are trousers?" "What on earth is a vest, Fay?"

I mean, I've totally been guilty of not paying close enough attention to the language, but if I wanted to write Harry Potter fic, I would certainly seek help from a British-type-person before posting it.

Mostly because I do not need more people up my ass, but hey...

A more extreme version of this phenomenon shows up in anime fandom. Some fans are hyper-aware of the shows' Japanese origins, to the point where their fics are larded with Japanese words or phrases when it's totally not necessary for the plot. Entire conversations may even be in Japanese. It's gotten to the point where some fics have footnotes and glossaries. Even worse, many of these people who are trying to "sound authentic" have a piss-poor grasp of Japanese grammar (or so I've heard--I don't know Japanese).

Personally, I think that sort of behavior is the worst kind of pseudo-intellectual arrogance.

That's the sort of thing a U.S. beta would be able to do without nearly as much soul-searching and second-guessing oneself.

This is true, Anne-- and I've had a couple of US folks beta it already. I should take deep breaths and relax; it's just I was really enjoying this fic, until suddenly bam! not any more, or at least, not nearly as much. It's annoyed me.

I think it's often a double-standard in fandom -- Brits bemoan American negligence, and often don't realize (realise!) that the same thing applies in reverse.

There are some times it's not easy-- I'm quite aware of the vocabulary, I think, but I do use British spellings, and that may annoy some. I don't notice spelling as much when I read, though. I had quite a fight with one beta when I was writing in M*A*S*H fandom-- I wrote a section of diary or letter, in an American voice, and she wanted me to use American spellings in it. I forget what I decided in the end, but it wasn't an easy choice to make.

A more extreme version of this phenomenon shows up in anime fandom. Some fans are hyper-aware of the shows' Japanese origins, to the point where their fics are larded with Japanese words or phrases when it's totally not necessary for the plot. Entire conversations may even be in Japanese. It's gotten to the point where some fics have footnotes and glossaries.

Firefly fandom has something similar at times-- because the show used Chinese words, people try and copy that, but they don't get the translations right (I'm told), and they have to put footnotes, and stuff. It can work, but it can be overdone (and the show itself struggled, I think). The whole question of what's atmosphere and colour, and what just gets in the way of telling to story, is a very thorny one.