Jintian was the one who put together the list of plagiarized passages in one chapter of Cassandra Claire's Draco Veritas here; I helped by identifying various obscure fantasy novels (that is, works by Pamela Dean and Elizabeth Marie Pope) as sources, as well as some of the Buffy quotes Jintian didn't recognize. Jintian doesn't cite it, but there's a two-page section in another chapter of the novel lifted directly from Pamela Dean's The Hidden Land.

For what it's worth--and here we are passing from the realm of concrete evidence--there were several other passages that seemed extremely familiar to me, but whose source I could not identify.

I should warn you, prolonged discussion of this topic in public almost always results in CC's fans popping up to defend her (and occasionally abuse her critics). Jintian's blog got a lot of anonymous comments, not all of them positive, after she went through that exercise.

So, rapidly changing the subject...

Err...

Serious question here...

How do you all define "plotty"?

Plotty? As in having the emphasis on plot events rather than character reaction to happenings, emotional epiphanies, PWPs and all that?

Well, I didn't mean to derail the conversation, just thought that a warning might be appropriate. We're a lot more public than we used to be, here.

To me, "plotty" means the point of the story is the unfolding events, not character interactions or character development (or The Sex.)

How do you all define "plotty"?

Something happens above and beyond "and then they got together." Also, I'd say it usually has to be fairly long - it'd be tough to write a plotty vignette.

Huh - poking at my reaction a little more I think it has to do most of all with how embedded in an outside world a story is. A story which was written to get them together can still be plotty if it feels like it's happening in a real world, where other things have an impact on the characters and vice versa.

As in having the emphasis on plot events rather than character reaction to happenings, emotional epiphanies

In my world emotional epiphanies are plot events.

Um.

People write PWPs that are plotty by my standards, too.

Plotty? As in having the emphasis on plot events rather than character reaction to happenings, emotional epiphanies, PWPs and all that?

Define plot events. I'm feeling very short bus this morning.

"Plotty" to me doesn't necessarily mean that the plot and not the character development is the point. I've certainly seen plotty stories whose entire point was ultimately some emotional arc. For me, it means a story in which a lot happens, and at a steady pace throughout -- rather than one where the characters sit around and chat or brood or contemplate their navel lint.