Spike's Bitches 28: For the Safety of Puppies...and Christmas!
[NAFDA] Spike-centric discussion. Lusty, lewd (only occasionally crude), risque (and frisque), bawdy (Oh, lawdy!), flirty ('cuz we're purty), raunchy talk inside. Caveat lector.
wrt Izzard and gender issues - I thought he just liked to wear women's clothes too. Which is, in some ways,
not
a gender-confusing thing, inasmuchas lots of women like to wear trousers, and in Egypt most men wear robes, and all that stuff. But it's a bit more complicated, because Izzard likes to wear
women's
trousers/jackets/etc specifically, doesn't he? So it's not simply aesthetic. Plus, in one of the DVDs of one of the tours (er, I forget which) he has false breasts, and, bless him, he talks about the whole wanting-to-have-breasts thing as part of the act. Which left me thinking "...huh..." on the whole gender identification thing.
...Nope, no conclusions here. Just "gosh, isn't life/sex/self complex" type of thoughts.
In this Salon interview: [link] , Izzard says:
How do you explain the allure of dressing up in women's clothes?
It's not an allure, it's just a sexuality. It's the only way I can express the feminine side of myself as a member of the transgender community. If you have an outwardly biological bloke's body, then that's the only way you can move toward where you feel more comfortable. I mean, women can already do it -- they can be tomboys and that's no problem.
That reads to me as some degree of gender dysphoria.
Though it doesn't really matter, does it? I was just trying to offer a different perspective on guys who call themselves lesbians in women's bodies -- they're not all being smarmy jackholes.
If he wants tits, he can have mine. I'm tired of them. Hanging around, mooching off me, doing nothing productive, getting in the way. My husband, however, considers them decorative, and he should have some say in how his environment looks.
meara--you crossdress. In your experience, is it something that can be done without any gender dysphoria? And that's not Izzard-related, just general.
The person I know who most determinedly crossdressed recently started the medical transgender procedure.
I've always thought one of the perks to being a chick is that I could wear men's clothes without raising
too
much of an eyebrow. However, it's been years since I looked male with any consistency--and when I did, it wasn't on purpose.
I'm not sure why I like men's clothes--and since I'm too lazy to shop with too much of a purpose, it's not like I go to the trouble of dressing up like a guy, since that'd be work. Just sometimes it's all men's clothes.
Prosthetics? No interest there.
eta:
I mean, women can already do it -- they can be tomboys and that's no problem.
See, that's the thing. I don't think tomboying
is
gender dysphoria--it's just a rejection of convention. I've never wanted to be a guy.
See, that's the thing. I don't think tomboying is gender dysphoria--it's just a rejection of convention. I've never wanted to be a guy.
I totally agree there. But I don't think his "tomboy" statement is representative of his entire sexuality. It might be the comparison that works best when he's interviewed by people who, by and large, don't understand a transvestite POV.
I can't really deconstruct Izzard's sexuality based on interviews. Just thought I'd offer an example.
I think it's reasonable (and hopefully common) for men to be feminists. However, I sincerely doubt that many of these men-lesbians actually feel they're a woman in a man's body, and that's where the whole thing fails for me.
Er, yeah. Most of the men I've ever met who've said that (EDIT: about being a man-lesbian--being a man-feminist is quite good, I say) are...smarmy jackholes. Minus the one or two who were transgendered and actually were BECOMING women...:)
meara--you crossdress. In your experience, is it something that can be done without any gender dysphoria?
Hrm. Yes and no. Like said above, it's easier for women to do it and not even be NOTICED, so it's not as much a thing, necessarily. OTOH, many women who dress almost exclusively in men's clothing and so on, well, yeah, there's some dysphoria going on there. Personally, while I love a good genderfuck and find it really hot, I don't feel any more gender dysphoria than your average woman does, I think? But enjoying dressing up as a guy is just...fun! But it's not the same for guys, because of our culture--dressing up as a girl for them is a whole other thing, usually, so those who actually DO it probably have more issue, ya know?
Poor Cindy, your whole family fell over like slow moving dominoes. Next time maybe everybody gargles with peroxide and wears little hazmat suits until the crud passes victim #1.
No kidding. I didn't have my favorite cleanser early in the week (Clorox Quick Clean--or something like that--it's got bleach) and I'm blaming some of this on that.
This was the slowest moving stomach virus I can remember us having (although we might have had a slow one in early 2001 too, but I've mostly blocked it out). I'm not sure if Julia's in the clear or not. I'd say she is, because she had some symptoms early last week. But Ben had those symptoms early last week, and then had the full blown virus late in the week.
I'd like to open the windows, but it's too cold.
I can't really deconstruct Izzard's sexuality based on interviews.
I'm sorry if it seemed I was backing you into that position. I'm not hardly surprised it comes across a million ways. Me, I had a little bit invested in seeing it one way (all man plus extra woman, basically) so I was interested in exploring the opposition.
so those who actually DO it probably have more issue, ya know?
I love the idea of a perfectly straight (not even bi, because it confuses the issue) perfectly happy to be a guy guy dressing in women's clothes because he likes them, and doesn't care what other people think.
Whenever it happens.
I am back from lunch with Sail and brenda. Sadly, my digital camera battery would not take a charge, so I have no pictures. Brenda took some with her camera phone, but dunno if she has a way of hosting them.
My understanding of the "lesbian in a man's body" thing is a man who loves women but doesn't approach and interract with women in a manner consistent with traditional male gender roles, but rather in androgynous or feminine ways. Gah, it's been ages since I met someone who described himself that way, and I can't explain it any better....
Pretty holiday pictures! I forgot to take any pictures this year.
The semi-annual sale starts tomorrow, and we are supposed to have a snow storm.
