They have to catch you.

Don't the casinos write the rules? So if they say card counting is against the rules, it is.

True. But I still think it's not unethical. You do what you can to win. If they don't like the way you play, they essentially tell you, "We don't want you as a customer." Capitalism marches on.

I don't think it's against the law to count cards - in my mind, it's not the same as stealing.

"We started with the idea of Moe as Charles Bukowski," explains Matt Warburton, who wrote the episode. "We brought Lisa in as the person who discovers in scuzzy, barfly Moe something that we've never seen before: a poet." Antics ensue, with Wolfe and fellow guest stars Gore Vidal, Michael Chabon and Jonathan Franzen voicing themselves. All were thrilled to participate.

Heh. Can't wait to see Chabon's flowing locks rendered in Simpsons-imation.

Speaking of writers, the publisher has acknowledged receipt of my book pitch. I'll hear sometime at the end of January. Ohmmmmmmmmm.

Also, I don't think it's unethical to count cards.

A case where a guy counting cards was barred from a casino - so he sued: [link] The case has not been settled yet.

I dont' understand how/why it's against the rules. Many people who do it can't help it (like whoever's cousin it was) I think that it's just a way of playing the game. and how do they prove it, anyway. "Look, you can see his eyes moving, He's clearly thinking "

Don't the casinos write the rules? So if they say card counting is against the rules, it is.

Sure, it's against their rules. But that doesn't make it unethical. Jaywalking or speeding are against the rules. But not unethical.

Isn't card counting essentially just having a good memory and grasp of statistics, as opposed to sneaking in your own cards or having an accomplice that looks at the other players' hands? Throwing someone out for having the skill is essentially the same as telling a poker player they have too good a poker face and showing them the door.

I dont' understand how/why it's against the rules.

I think it's along the lines of, "We have the right to refuse service to anyone."

If you're counting cards, the usual way (I think) is to watch and/or make small wagers until the odds are in your favor. Then you make a big wager. That pattern calls attention to itself.

Card counters often have an accomplice who strides up and places a wager for the first time when the counter gives a signal. They are more difficult to catch, but still, they often are.

Throwing someone out for having the skill is essentially the same as telling a poker player they have too good a poker face and showing them the door.

Yeah, essentially.

I dont' understand how/why it's against the rules

It's against the rules because they say so.

As far as I'm concerned, the ethical thing to do in a situation like this is to not play -- breaking the rules someone else has every right to set (I mean, we're not talking injury or anything) isn't ethical in my book.

Understandable, sure. Ethical, nope.

I don't think it's unethical to count cards. I think it's unethical to break the casino's rules.

Yeah, essentially.

I agree. However, you've walked into their house to take their money. They get to be insane in defense of their profit. You get to bet elsewhere.