The idea of the holiday is so wedded in my mind with the religious significance that I can't see myself having a purely secular celebration

Because of the years without church - it isn't for me. DH may have had more problems with it but 1) he likes giving me gifts and 2) he likes giving 3) and all the trimmings - are mine and for me, and he can chose or not chose to get invovled in most of it.

Aren't all secular Jews an example?

I admit, I don't know much about Judaism, whether Orthodox or secular. So I didn't want to create an even bigger muddle by trying to compare it to Judaism.

TB, I tend to think you're right because the judge ordered that specific rehab program.

Aren't all secular Jews an example?

But Judaism is sorta an ethnicity as well as a religion.

Good point, Trudy. I was conflating ethnicity and culture in my mind.

Aren't all secular Jews an example?

If Judaism is something that can be conferred on someone by birth only then I don't think it's the same.

I claim my ethingc background - or cultural background, more accurately, is WASP. Living in fremont,ca - where that is not a majority - might make it clear why I ID as I do.

but now, I have to go to work. stooopid protestant work ethic.

The WAS part is ethnic. It's just the P that's not.

Hec, want me to kick her butt? It won't be as definitive as an ita asskick, but quite memorable, nonetheless.

I was conflating ethnicity and culture in my mind.

The WAS part is ethnic. It's just the P that's not.

Didn't we have a discussion a while back about the terms "ethnicity" vs. "race"? I had an argument with chatty!co-worker because he referred to fundie Christians as an ethnic group. I said they weren't; he said they were, citing the Webster definition of "ethnic": "Of or relating to a sizable group of people sharing a common and distinctive racial, national, religious, linguistic, or cultural heritage," emphasizing the "religious" part of that definition.

I still feel like he's wrong, but I can't articulate why, and it's very frustrating.