Veronica's 18 and not watching the show. She's living it. Whether she objectively thought it had any validity as possible cheating on her (and, honestly, I don't think she activated the chip with that in mind - what she expected to find is probably pretty much what she found), it's still very much NOT the kind of foolishness you what you want to hear when you've been looking forward to seeing your boyfriend all day and he fails to show.

Veronica's 19 (although Logan is probably still 18), and I'm 39 and will have been married 12 years by the end of this month, but I don't know what that has to do with it, anyhow.

Veronica's quick on her feet, and notices things. That's what she does. It's valid to expect her to pick up on something that's pretty obvious: if you suspect a lover of cheating and hiding his infidelities, if he is cheating, he probably won't leave you a phone message from a loud party, and make a crack about getting lucky at the end of his message. I'm not saying I don't understand how/why she missed that. I do. She missed it because of her trust issues. Even she knows that. I mentioned it because it's clear how far the green eyed monster's fangs are stuck in her neck.

Gris, I'm just going to restate the discussion up to this point, because I'm not sure what the issue is.

I think both Veronica and Logan were in the wrong in this episode, but I think activating the GPS on a lover's cell phone without telling him, and using it to track him down; trying to control his free time; planting a tracking device in his car, showing up when he's in someone else's dorm room playing cards, and publically demanding that he leave with you (she lacked all discretion) is worse on the scale of Lover-Behavior, than skipping classes; playing poker; doing the evasive fade-away thing; but calling when you can't show up (albeit leaving a message possibly intended to push buttons connected to feelings she's already made clear are in overdrive). Again, I think they both sucked, I just think she sucked more.

Is it fair to say that you think the opposite? I'm glad to agree to disagree, but I just want to know what we're agreeing to disagree about.

It's valid to expect her to pick up on something that's pretty obvious: if you suspect a lover of cheating and hiding his infidelities, if he is cheating, he probably won't leave you a phone message from a loud party, and make a crack about getting lucky at the end of his message.

Right, and -- it ocurred to me last night that I've made that kind of joke to BFs before, and they've made them to me. ("Where are you going tomorrow night?" "To meet my other girlfriend.")

The rudeness on Logan's part is in his avoidy-ness of Veronica, and blowing off plans via voice-mail. Absolutely. But the content of the voice-mail itself really didn't justify activating the Lo(gan)Jack.

The voicemail was disrespectful when it's clear she's already unhappy. I'd go apeshit.

Lo(gan)Jack.

Dear lord this is my favorite phrase eva!

I really think that Logan was trying to pick a fight with Veronica -- just an arguement. I mean, he knows better - right?

1) Not that interested in hanging out with her 2) especially not when she's doing something a little "weird" that she wants to do with him unless 3) there is sex involved. The problem, in my eyes, is not that he's gambling his night away and she disapproves - though she does, clearly - but that he seems to be avoiding her to do that instead. Possibly consistently.

I agree with this. Also, when she was talking to Logan he said something like, "I think I am about to get lucky." To me he is either incredibly stupid (which I don't think he is) or he was trying to get a certain reaction from Veronica, which is what he got. I hate Logan. This episode just increased that for me. I want Weevil to get his act together so that he and Veronica can figure out that they're in love.

Uh-huh. Sorry folks, I'm not entirely buying the Logan defending. Yes, Veronica went well over the line, but as anyone who's had a girlfriend for five minutes should be able to see, Logan is blowing it: He's slipping into self-destructive behavior (skipping class, gambling) and blatantly acting suspicious. (I'm sorry, if I ever called any woman I've ever been involved with with the message, "Can't make it, looks like I might get lucky" with girls tittering in the background, I'd be a dead man and deserve it.)

So very much this.

A small point: I don't think he actually skipped class. We don't know that he did, obviously, since he refused to show Veronica his notes (rightly so, IMO).

We know he was at the beginning of the semester because it was brought up in the first episode, which means he was skipping classes right at the very beginning of the semester. I think Veronica has the right to be concerned about this. I think she was willing to accept what Dick said so easily, despite it being Dick, because of this.

I really think that Logan was trying to pick a fight with Veronica -- just an arguement. I mean, he knows better - right?

Right. I think he knew exactly what he was doing.

Would you rather get a semi-blow off, or have your s.o. secretly activate the GPS on your phone, and plant a tracking device in your car, and publically demand you leave a college party? I'd take the blow-off, any day.

Again, I'm still not defending Logan, but this episode was about Veronica's issues, not his issues (to which he probably has lifetime subscriptions).

The GPS is a little extreme, but I can accept that as being part of Veronica world. I thought she was totally within her rights to find him and demand some sort of explaination from him, and I think that is exactly what he was expecting her to do.

I thought she was totally within her rights to find him and demand some sort of explaination from him, and I think that is exactly what he was expecting her to do.

Right - if she does look for him, he not only gets validation and attention, but he gets to be self-righteous about her tracking him down like a stalker. If she doesn't, he gets away with blowing her off. It's a win-win for Logan pretty much.

Again, though, Veronica was in the serious wrong too. Hell, they both pretty much reset to their default worst behavior before eventually snapping out of it (for the moment).

Right - if she does look for him, he not only gets validation and attention, but he gets to be self-righteous about her tracking him down like a stalker. If she doesn't, he gets away with blowing her off. It's a win-win for Logan pretty much.

Exactly. I hate that. I am getting so sick of smart women on tv dating asshats.