Nice Guys think they're owed affection, and that's an important line I don't think X crosses.
Xander doesn't believe he deserves anything good. But he still wants good things.
I just think you're freakin' out 'cause you have to fight someone prettier than you.
Dawn ,'The Killer In Me'
Buffy and Angel 1: BUFFYNANGLE4EVA!!!!!1!
Is it better the second time around? Or the third? Or tenth? This is the place to come when you have a burning desire to talk about an old episode that was just re-run.
DavidS - Jan 06, 2012 7:19:17 am PST #8140 of 10459
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."
§ ita § - Jan 06, 2012 7:21:14 am PST #8141 of 10459
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
I think feeling owed, wanting, and deserving are different things. Only the first one is bad in this scenario. The second is perfectly reasonable, and the third is fine in moderation. He might be deserving of Buffy, but if she doesn't want him, that's irrelevant.
Frankenbuddha - Jan 06, 2012 7:44:23 am PST #8142 of 10459
"We are the Goon Squad and we're coming to town...Beep! Beep!" - David Bowie, "Fashion"
I also think that Xander's hate-on for Angel (and thus the BIG LIE) was as much (if not more) about hating on vampires in general (and what happened to Jesse) and specifically about what Angelus had put them through as it was about anything to do with Angel & Buffy.
Stop me before I parenthisize again.
P.M. Marc - Jan 06, 2012 7:48:18 am PST #8143 of 10459
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear
But can you call it that for someone who is 15 or 16? I don't think NGS applies to males who aren't men.
Yes.
You may know nicer Nice Guys than I do. I get being disappointed and covetous. Nice Guys think they're owed affection, and that's an important line I don't think X crosses.
My line is, are you a passive-aggressive douche about it? If so, you have NGS.
§ ita § - Jan 06, 2012 7:49:46 am PST #8144 of 10459
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
Xander was a passive aggressive douche? I thought he was pretty straightforward about the whole thing. Am I misremembering the whole first few seasons?
P.M. Marc - Jan 06, 2012 7:51:02 am PST #8145 of 10459
So come, my friends, be not afraid/We are so lightly here/It is in love that we are made; In love we disappear
Xander was a passive aggressive douche? I thought he was pretty straightforward about the whole thing. Am I misremembering the whole first few seasons?
It's probably more of a later-seasons issue for me.
§ ita § - Jan 06, 2012 8:15:07 am PST #8146 of 10459
Well not canonically, no, but this is transformative fiction.
In which relationships or non-relationships?
sj - Jan 06, 2012 8:19:00 am PST #8147 of 10459
"There are few hours in life more agreeable than the hour dedicated to the ceremony known as afternoon tea."
I also think that Xander's hate-on for Angel (and thus the BIG LIE) was as much (if not more) about hating on vampires in general (and what happened to Jesse) and specifically about what Angelus had put them through as it was about anything to do with Angel & Buffy.
I completely agree with this.
DavidS - Jan 06, 2012 8:22:00 am PST #8148 of 10459
"Look, son, if it's good enough for Shirley Bassey, it's good enough for you."
Ple, am I correct in remembering you have a similar disgruntlement with Ducky in Pretty in Pink?
erikaj - Jan 06, 2012 8:28:29 am PST #8149 of 10459
Always Anti-fascist!
I think Xander's just young. Also, that Angel's being a vampire provides him a convenient out for hate without having to look at the whole Buffy thing. Crushes are obsessive, due to the one-sided level of intensity in the relationship.